iirc sander already mentioned somewhere that they're looking into this and the il-2 loiter is likely to be added to one or two doctrines.
Stuff like this is great to see, but it really could have used another round of testing imo.
I asked to turn the main bases straight instead of this weird banana shape to improve the positioning for everyone, but sadly it being unique apparently took priority over better gameplay. Same with the damn trees everywhere on Lienne Forrest that your vehicles continuously get stuck on.
I got that position twice and I was done with the map.
Advancing past the midpoint is suicide because your retreat path goes through through the middle VP where the center players are duking out with everything they have. Once you cap your half, its usually more efficient to just help try and take the center VP.
Far left position on the bottom side of Ettelbrook Station is pure cancer to play. You cut across the middle on retreat. Its worth than Port of Hamburg.
The problem is people keep comparing it to the late game tank destroyers and wind up disappointed.
Its stats need to be compared against the medium tanks its intended to fight. It has better range, penetration, and RoF than any of the stock mediums while being faster than all but the Cromwell and 30+ fuel cheaper than all but the T-34. While it has nowhere near the range and firepower of the big allied TDs, it has enough for the job at hand at an excellent price point. Its raw speed also makes it an excellent diver who can get into the rear of Panthers where the armor doesn't matter as much, (especially vetted) and once it has HVAP its frontal penetration capabilities are solid enough to be a decent poker as well if needed.
Yeah, its lousy in larger team games, I don't think thats fixable without turning it into another Jackson. Flankers don't work well there and range and pen are king. USF and Brits are extremely doctrine dependent in the bigger team games as well, (and show no signs of changing) and even if you tuned the M10 for it I doubt Armor would beat out Infantry Company or the Calliope Docs.
If you want to see Armor in big team games, it would need to focus more on making the indirect on the 105 more potent and making their Sherman and especially Jackson feel more deadly than the stock versions. 240mm being turned into something people actually want to use wouldn't hurt either.
Armor still needs some work, (105, 240mm) but I don't really have a problem with the M10. Its never going to be a powerhouse in team games, where range and frontal penetration are king, but its good in 1v1 and retains some limited utility as a cheap Rocket Arty diver in team games.
It doesn't really need to be a scaling monstrosity that tag teams the first P4 and then spends the rest of the game being a pseudo Jackson. Its competitor at this cost and power level is the Stug. If it feels similarly powerful to that, then its fine. Only real change I would argue it could use is a size adjustment to bring it in line with the new medium tank sizes.
I'd rather spend what little time is left working on the other parts of Armor. (before the E8 crushes all other discussion again)
AEC mostly just feels late now. The combat performance feels in line with its cost, and Target Tread is a monster snare. Vickers could be more like a standard MG, blobs can be a problem to handle with Brits.
Hard disagree on basically everything said about the Engineers though.
The 10 manpower difference between them and Pioneers / Rear Echelons is barely noticeable, and their combat performance at vet 0 is in line with Pioneers. Their only real problem is that their vet 1 combat upgrade sucks. Meanwhile, they are one of the only units with a Snare that also makes a good handheld AT carrier. They have good mines, destroy cover, excellent cap speed, and a reinforce cost reduction at vet 3. Fix the vet 1 upgrade and they might be my favorite engineer.
The medpacks are the same price as Sturm Medkit drops but are infinitely better, (3 uses vs infinites) and you get the alternate option to just get Medics and keep the munitions for use elsewhere.
Commandos really shouldn't be the core unit Brits are based around. They allow for a fun style of play, but clearly aren't intended to be the focus of the faction.
A few things like the Vickers and AEC I at least partially agree on, but my list of problems with the faction is very different:
1) Base Arty sucks, and no mobile indirect is present in the faction. Limiting their ability to punish setup teams.
2) Smoke and close assault options are bad. Brits struggle to push back out on the map to retake lost ground.
3) Gameplay is too linear, and vehicle roster is too top heavy. With only 1 real LV in the AEC, and weak mid game infantry in the Assault Officer, British playstyles are incredibly predictable. Meanwhile, the top end of the vehicle roster is overloaded with units that just play too similarly to one another and don't diversify British capabilities the way something like the Scott, Brummbar, and Katusha do.
I actually rather like the Snares on the Engineers. Putting Snares on your PIAT carriers usually works out well for me. On average, I usually run about 2 RE squads anyway, so the difference in snares vs other factions is only 1-2, and they have both Sniper and AEC snares to help make up the difference.
As far as the homogenization goes. Any faction built around having missing tools compensated for by OP units is by definition going to be incredibly linear to play with and against. The games design is also built around each faction having a set of tools to play the game with. Asymmetry should come from how those tools are designed rather than a complete lack of them.
I am not really convinced that top 200 analysis is good approach in 3v3,4v4 because the amount of matches which passes the specs is very little. I don't think it is enough games to produce reliable results.
I think that mode is just going to take longer to collect a meaningful amount of data.
Isn't that basically identical to how Grens preform right now?
I'm still unsure as to how these won't just be a cheaper, more easily massable version of Grens that can make sandbags.
* Cost reduced to 280 and 8 pop. (Was 350 and 10 pop)
* Revert the setup/teardown times back to 3
I personally think you guys are being awfully hard on the unit. Its done its job for me when I used it of wiping setup teams and squads on points. No, it can't really handle moving blobs, but it breaks defensive positions well which is what I normally struggle to deal with as Brits. Once you get two, you throw a lot of big barrages downrange, and the wipes start adding up. A cost reduction will help you get the pair of them up and the reduced pop cap would help make it easier to fit them in a max army.
Designate Command Vehicle:
It really just needs a rewrite. As is it just feels completely backwards to use. Its in a faction (and docs) with some incredibly tough units, but the proper way to use it is to put it on the lightest vehicle you own. Take away some of the crazy buffs, and reduce the debuffs in exchange. Tank firepower is just too valuable to diminish, no matter how good the buffs are.
Vanguard Operations Glider:
* Can now build the 81mm Mortar
Brits need as much mobile indirect as they can lay their hands on. If they can't get it through the stock faction, then it needs to be in as many doctrines as possible with the exception of Improved Fortifications.
* Can now build the 81mm Mortar
With the new ability of Gliders to build Commandos, I think its worth investigating putting some indirect into Commando Regiment. The doc only unlocks a single unit, while everything else is a munitions sink of varying quality.
Air Resupply Operation:
Can this just drop Vickers and AT Rifles instead of Medcrates? The medkits feel really awkward.
Likewise, I think it might make for some interesting choices if the M3 dropped AT Rifles rather than PIATs.
I'm usually pretty critical of these expensive area denial tools, and Concentration Barrage is no exception. The AOE on it does feel larger than the Railway or 240mm, but I'd have to check the hard stats to be sure. Its still really expensive for what it does though.
Further ideas for Commander changes:
* Valentine Light Tank
* Logistics Glider (with added Mortar)
* Vehicle Repair
* Crocodile Churchill
* Hawker Overflight
I've been pretty vocal about my dislike of the vehicle/fast cap abilities, and Raid Operation is no exception. The Valentine would love to see the light of day in another doc, and with the added Mortar would make it a complete doc for Brits.
SPECIAL WEAPONS REGIMENT:
* Tank Hunters
* Resupply Half Track
* Concentrated Fire Operation
* Land Mattress
Hold the Line and Concentrated Fire Operation together always felt weird. Even with the reduced cost on Hold the Line, you have two huge munitions sinks in a single doc. With Hold the Line moving to Improved Fortifications, it makes sense to drop it from Special Weapons and give it a tool it actually has a chance to use. The combination of the Land Mattress and Crocodile should give this company excellent breakthrough capabilities in the late game.
* Recovery Engineers
* Smoke Raid
* Infiltration Commandos
* Land Mattress
* Vehicle Crew Repair
I think the Mortar + Land Mattress is probably overkill here. Smoke Raid plays into the theme of a Mobile British force well and helps overcome the poor quality of British Smoke. An alternative munitions sink could likewise work here as well.
* Recovery Engineers
* Designate Command Vehicle
* Defensive Operations
* Anti Building Mortar Barrage
I'd really like to put the Land Mattress here, but I'm not sure if the balance team would go for 3 docs with it. The improved Defensive Operations is a decent alternative for an Engineering Company, which should excel at things like constructing fortifications and laying mines.
In total, these changes would give some form of mobile indirect to every doctrine except Advanced Emplacement and Royal Engineers. (And even RE I'd love to see get some)
4 Doctrines would have access to a Mortar, although everyone but Lend/Lease is going to have to do some side teching to get it. (possibly too much) 2 Doctrines would now have the Land Mattress, and Royal Artillery would have the Sexton.
Finally, the changes would help balance out some of the awkward munitions costs in most Docs, although Commando remains largely untouched with a full 4 abilities.