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Thread: Soviet teching comparison5 Jan 2021, 20:05 PM Past balance decisions have trended towards cheapening tech for other factions/ making some units available earlier, and so I think some reduction in SOV optional tech costs is overdue. My personal preference would be to increase the number of meaningful economic choices other factions have to make though. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 19:45 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 19:23 PMgbem in any case as ive said before pgrens come much earlier than their intended counter (allied LVs) and the influence they exert as an earlygame NONDOCTRINAL elite seems quite insane... Ahh yes Pgrens intended counter the AEC or Stuart. This whole thread has been built from the point of SOV-OST match up since SOV is the faction sturggling with PGs SOV is struggling ergo nerf OST? Neither of you play any faction other than SOVs. If you did you'd realize that OST has 2 other match-ups that Pgrens are balanced around. Your short-sighted reasoning will make 2 problems for every problem you fix. I'm done with your circular "but muh poor SOVs". In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 18:40 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 18:27 PMgbem read your own post retard of course its fucking relevant... my whole point was to disprove this entire post and how fucking stupid it is to try to go T1 at all vs ostheer... the whole point is the paragraph you have made above is nothing but nonsense... now stop being intellectually dishonest and admit your mistake Absolutely none of what you've posted is relevant to that. If you really want to go t2 against pgrens make a sacrifice for a softer counter and build maxims. I'm not opening that can of worms though since you can't handle something as simple as discussing the cost of openings without resorting to "BUT SOVS NEED ZIS SO PLUS 1,000,000,000 MANPOWER COST. PGRENS OP!!!!111" In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 18:20 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 18:08 PMgbem it is relevant to your retarded point of building sniper/M3/T1 to counter pgrens... maybe if youve never derailed the pgren discussion with your halfarsed "ideas" for a counter we could steer the discussion back to pgrens appropriately as opposed to discussing how retarded soviet teching is... in any case as ive said before pgrens come much earlier than their intended counter (allied LVs) and the influence they exert as an earlygame NONDOCTRINAL elite seems quite insane... It's completely irrelevant. Every post in this thread I have to guide us back to the topic at hand before you wander off into some "oh yeah well the brumbar counters combat engies, therefore Pgrens OP" derail. You've already made a thread for soviet tech costs. Please go discuss them there, and admit that the past 4-5 pages of arguing have actually had very little to do with Pgrens other than being an outlet for you to vent your pathetic SOV-OST win rate. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 18:03 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 17:56 PMgbem because the zis gun is integral to soviet lategame play... 1. barrage can disloge team weapons and control blobs... 2. as with all facs AT guns are required to repel medium armor... AT infantry will not suffice unless you are some 4v4 player... AT walls are very much meta is any gamemode for a good reason... Right. So ZiS is completely irrelevant to pgren timing, and you only mentioned it because you were pathetically grasping for anything to buttress your broken argument about costs. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 17:49 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 04:34 AMgbem youre also ignoring the fact that the soviets NEED to build T2 for the AT gun if they go T1... thats another 160/15 to the pricetag.... The part in question. You're claiming SOVs need T2 for AT. Why do SOVs need AT if OST doesn't have to build any buildings capable of armor? You absolutely need a field gun for the terrifying armored monstrosity that is the 250? In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 17:25 PM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 07:16 AMSerrith A more realistic(and actual meta build) would be: Ask yourself why you are comparing SOV pgren counters to OST openers that don't even include a single pgren in the cost. The height of intellectual dishonesty. 1x Pio 2x Mg42 BP 1 1x Pgren For a total of 1160mp/40 fuel. Or maybe a common osttruppen build: 1x MG42 3x Osttruppen BP 1 1x Pgren 1300 mp and 40 fuel So hypothetical: T1 1x Sniper 2x Conscripts 1000mp 10fuel for the same number of squads as the first build but less than the second. Or 3x conscripts for an extra squad to outnumber/match ost squad count, but your MP cost has jumped to 1240 vs ost with 820/960. Or if we go clown car build: T1 1x CE(for flamethrower and early capping) Clown car 2x Conscripts We end up with 1000mp and 25fuel, though we get the car as well. If we wanna compare against 2x pio 2x MG please remember that the point is map control. 2x MG builds have awful map control and merely stall once discovered. If we really want to be honest we'd be considering builds that include multiple pgrens. I've been charitable using builds with just one pgren, and also done my best to limit dishonest "but what about this build" squabbling that you've predictably jumped to. Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 11:03 AMgbem SOV teching costs even more than ost teching... adding buildings into the equation hurts your argument even further... SOV tech costs suck therefore OST tech is free? Could you be anymore dishonest? In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 04:48 AM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 04:34 AMgbem incorrect since the soviets have retarded sidetech costs I'm sorry is this thread about optional soviet sidetech costs that are already being addressed by the balance team or is it about Pgrens? youre also ignoring the fact that the soviets NEED to build T2 for the AT gun if they go T1... Guards, m-42, or trade conscripts for penals if you absolutely need some other doctrine. Please remember that OST vehicles and buildings aren't free if you're going to try and add costs to the soviets. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 04:20 AM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 03:57 AMSkysTheLimit You just did sniper OR clowncar. He said sniper AND clown car... That means in one build If you actually read Serriths post you will find nothing close to him saying that ost is OP. Relax His post was in response to my own where I stated snipers and clown cars are both counters. I don't understand why, but he interpreted that as meaning you have to build both, whereas my original intent was that one or the other can serve as counter. I expanded on the concept to clarify what I meant since he interpreted it as a combo instead of an either or thing. E: Consider if I had said instead : "well ostrupen are countered with t70, t34, t34-85, katyusha, IS2, KV-1, KV-2, KV-8, and ISU". Would you not consider it bizarre if someone had interpreted that as having to simultaneously build 9 different vehicles to counter one unit? In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Will they address Panzergrens in the new patch?5 Jan 2021, 02:52 AM Jump back to quoted post5 Jan 2021, 00:53 AMSerrith How does one get a sniper AND a clown car AND outnumber ost in squads by the time Pgrens hit the field? 1x T1 (160/10) 1x Clown car (190/15) 4x conscripts (240) 1310 manpower 25 fuel -OR- 1x T1 1x Sniper 3x conscripts 1,240 manpower 10 fuel VS _________________________ 1x MG 1x T1 2x Gren 1x BP1 1x Pgren 1260 manpower 50 fuel In both cases you're looking at 5x mobile squads vs 4x mobile squads and a crew weapon. I was even charitable to your argument and went with full conscripts over a 2nd CE. Soviets will field their army faster unless OST is allowed all the fuel they want. Are you guys just letting OST cap the whole map, and that's why you think they're OP? In: COH2 Balance