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Does CoH1 have a future?

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11 Jun 2015, 22:48 PM
#61
avatar of Basilone

Posts: 1935 | Subs: 2

1) Coh1 wasn't plagued by snipers ACs etc because the game was inherently flawed it was simple balance fixes Relic didn't care enough about to invest in. You know this already though Von but ofc you're going to discredit coh1 because you're known for being a good coh2 player far moreso than in coh1.

2) Plenty of "meta" scrubs in coh2 as well, half of the games I played in coh2 were regurgitations of the flavor of the month strategy, which is even more depressing in a game with far more units and commanders. Even if the t1 build orders varies a bit more the mid and late game unit compositions are more monotonous than in coh1.
12 Jun 2015, 00:29 AM
#62
avatar of DonnieChan

Posts: 1664 | Subs: 1

in coh2 feel i have many options and possibilities in every stage of the game to give my game a certain style. and i disagree with basilone, i find the lategame very diverse and fun to play with the vet units, heavy tanks, light armor and commander abilities.
The coh1 lategame i remember was mainly about flak88, snipers and calliope.

Actually i find coh2 in a very good, and even balanced state right now. And you can also play competetively. Usually most of my 1v1 and 2v2 games are very challenging and fun to play. And the atmosphere is simply fantastic.

i also have the feeling all the bashers in this forum haven't played the game for a year. Much has happened.
12 Jun 2015, 00:51 AM
#63
avatar of Basilone

Posts: 1935 | Subs: 2

Theres more options but not more effective options. Shrek blob osttruppen 0-1 vehicles and a KT. That is every vs Okw game I've played spanning multiple patches. More ways to be creative for a few individuals that like to think outside the box but the average coh2 player definitely prefers filling the meta mold. I'm speaking to 1v1 right now which I've played just enough over the past 2 months to know not a whole lot has changed in the past 6 months. I've always thought coh2 was a decent team game but 1v1 has felt inferior to 2.602 vcoh since release.
12 Jun 2015, 14:15 PM
#64
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419

I accidently got coh2 when i buyed the humble bundle. I played alpha and beta before, so i was quite curious what has changed.
Once i started the game, i was welcomed with dlc commercials wtf??
In coh1 you had also your annoying blinking window on the left, but now it fills the complete screen!
I tried Oberkommando West the first time and was confused about the brit like truck gameplay. Why again relic? People complained about this shit before coh2 was even made. I won´t expand my rant about getting an ATgun as a first unit, otherwise this text will become too long.
Buildable units of the trucks feel randomly placed. In coh1 you had an arc of unit development (infantry-> armored vehicles-> tanks). Along this setup you had the pressure of creating an effective AT counter. Now this seems completly messed up.
Why do you have the ability to choose, which kind of arty will destroy the enemy base, once you have already won the match? This option doesnt grant me any advantage or variety ingame.

Coh1 will have a future, but not a big one. As long as people play and stream, who care about a good game.
12 Jun 2015, 17:09 PM
#65
avatar of VonIvan

Posts: 2396 | Subs: 22

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Jun 2015, 00:29 AMDonnieChan
in coh2 feel i have many options and possibilities in every stage of the game to give my game a certain style. and i disagree with basilone, i find the lategame very diverse and fun to play with the vet units, heavy tanks, light armor and commander abilities.
The coh1 lategame i remember was mainly about flak88, snipers and calliope.

Actually i find coh2 in a very good, and even balanced state right now. And you can also play competetively. Usually most of my 1v1 and 2v2 games are very challenging and fun to play. And the atmosphere is simply fantastic.

i also have the feeling all the bashers in this forum haven't played the game for a year. Much has happened.

Translation: Easier for DonnieChan to spam and go hardcore meta 24/7. :foreveralone:
14 Jun 2015, 19:10 PM
#66
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4290 | Subs: 2

I accidently got coh2 when i buyed the humble bundle. I played alpha and beta before, so i was quite curious what has changed.

1. Once i started the game, i was welcomed with dlc commercials wtf??
In coh1 you had also your annoying blinking window on the left, but now it fills the complete screen!

2. I tried Oberkommando West the first time and was confused about the brit like truck gameplay. Why again relic? People complained about this shit before coh2 was even made. I won´t expand my rant about getting an ATgun as a first unit, otherwise this text will become too long.

3. Buildable units of the trucks feel randomly placed. In coh1 you had an arc of unit development (infantry-> armored vehicles-> tanks). Along this setup you had the pressure of creating an effective AT counter. Now this seems completly messed up.

4. Why do you have the ability to choose, which kind of arty will destroy the enemy base, once you have already won the match? This option doesnt grant me any advantage or variety ingame.

Coh1 will have a future, but not a big one. As long as people play and stream, who care about a good game.


1. that is the first gripe? have you noticed various other UI improvements and added features in the main menu?

2. play more and you'll see okw trucks and brit trucks are pretty different. although i still despise them for how they scale into bigger game modes.

3. each to their own.

4. a neat cosmetic touch. doesn't force you to do anything about it. i for one love dropping papers above enemy's base when i win as sov. other times, i dont care at all. how can one even complain about that?
15 Jun 2015, 06:02 AM
#67
avatar of Basilone

Posts: 1935 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Jun 2015, 19:10 PMpigsoup


1. that is the first gripe? have you noticed various other UI improvements and added features in the main menu?

2. play more and you'll see okw trucks and brit trucks are pretty different. although i still despise them for how they scale into bigger game modes.

3. each to their own.

4. a neat cosmetic touch. doesn't force you to do anything about it. i for one love dropping papers above enemy's base when i win as sov. other times, i dont care at all. how can one even complain about that?

1. What improved in menu besides a cooler background screen? No leaderboard, inferior chat interface, comparatively horrendous tactical map, meaningless "rank." The only improvement in-game imo is the top right icons that shows units currently in production.
15 Jun 2015, 07:24 AM
#68
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4290 | Subs: 2


1. What improved in menu besides a cooler background screen? No leaderboard, inferior chat interface, comparatively horrendous tactical map, meaningless "rank." The only improvement in-game imo is the top right icons that shows units currently in production.


comparing to open beta coh2,

improved UI when searching for the game, when out of the game, viewable match stats when searching, added chat, rearranged UI for the better as whole (imo), watching live games, improved inventory UI etc etc?

coh2 isn't perfect, i mean match stats are basic as hell, but to have a go at that one tiny thing while there are obvious improvements from a year ago.... btw, that slot promotes community members, too via community map highlight 'advert'.

the whole post just comes off as a desperate attempt to pick holes at coh2. i mean, coh2 already has glaring holes guys!? you don't have to try to make holes by nitpicking and griping about the most insignificant details in the game.
15 Jun 2015, 07:40 AM
#69
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Jun 2015, 19:10 PMpigsoup


1. that is the first gripe? have you noticed various other UI improvements and added features in the main menu?

2. play more and you'll see okw trucks and brit trucks are pretty different. although i still despise them for how they scale into bigger game modes.

3. each to their own.

4. a neat cosmetic touch. doesn't force you to do anything about it. i for one love dropping papers above enemy's base when i win as sov. other times, i dont care at all. how can one even complain about that?


The setup of the menu us abit confusing. However thats what you get used to and dont bother anymore after some time (the same was with coh1).
However i don´t like the redundant art stuff in the menu, for example when you are searching for a game and it shows you a radar map, which grants you no information. Also being able to unlock different art colorations or the victory arty, shows you, that relic developers focused more on redundant stuff with the possibility to sell it, than creating a good gameplay. Coh1 didnt need all this crap, because the core game was already enough to entertain you for years (and still does).

The problem of the trucks is, that you cannot cut off your enemy, which is one of the most important strategies to win. There is no way to fix this other than to let the trucks stay in the base sector, where they belong.
the fact that relic decided to put that stuff into the successor, showed that they dont care about the criticism of their customers. The other possibility is, that they are a bunch of idio.. Sry, but that is the other logical solution.

"each to their own" Pls explain!

Basically i was talking about this at the beginning. Having this in place doesnt harm anyone, however it shows you that relic had their focus on redundant stuff to earn money.
15 Jun 2015, 08:04 AM
#70
avatar of pigsoup
Patrion 14

Posts: 4290 | Subs: 2



The setup of the menu us abit confusing. However thats what you get used to and dont bother anymore after some time (the same was with coh1).
However i don´t like the redundant art stuff in the menu, for example when you are searching for a game and it shows you a radar map, which grants you no information. Also being able to unlock different art colorations or the victory arty, shows you, that relic developers focused more on redundant stuff with the possibility to sell it, than creating a good gameplay. Coh1 didnt need all this crap, because the core game was already enough to entertain you for years (and still does).

The problem of the trucks is, that you cannot cut off your enemy, which is one of the most important strategies to win. There is no way to fix this other than to let the trucks stay in the base sector, where they belong.
the fact that relic decided to put that stuff into the successor, showed that they dont care about the criticism of their customers. The other possibility is, that they are a bunch of idio.. Sry, but that is the other logical solution.

"each to their own" Pls explain!

Basically i was talking about this at the beginning. Having this in place doesnt harm anyone, however it shows you that relic had their focus on redundant stuff to earn money.


i agree with this post a lot more. "each to their own [opinion]" as i think lesser structure is nicer while you don't. which is my general feeling to this post. your last post felt to me baseless but now that you explained more, i see more merit.

but to be honest, if relic IS trying to make money off of these pointless stuffs, what is taking so long? and they debut their decal system with ONE decal ffs. no one knows what relic is thinking. although i hear next patch is gonna be damn good.
15 Jun 2015, 14:55 PM
#71
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Jun 2015, 08:04 AMpigsoup


i agree with this post a lot more. "each to their own [opinion]" as i think lesser structure is nicer while you don't. which is my general feeling to this post. your last post felt to me baseless but now that you explained more, i see more merit.

but to be honest, if relic IS trying to make money off of these pointless stuffs, what is taking so long? and they debut their decal system with ONE decal ffs. no one knows what relic is thinking. although i hear next patch is gonna be damn good.


No, its a design issue, not mere opinion bias. in Coh1 you start the game with riflemen, which fight other riflemen. the one squad wins, which uses cover and the optimal range of their weapons. The next step is an armored vehicle, which can´t be killed by rifles or improving your infantry by buying veterancy or better equipemnt. It costs alot of ressources though, so its a high risk, but high reward tech.
The enemy can counter armored vehicles by teching for AT weapons. As the game goes along, you tech for heavier armored vehicles (tanks), which require better AT weapons. A good mix of AT/AI normally will win you the game, if you dont loose units.
In coh2 you have an atgun (hardcounter!) from the start and you can build a late game vehicle in early game. There is no tech choice anymore, thus no variety. You already have everything, which makes the game boring.
15 Jun 2015, 21:11 PM
#72
avatar of Basilone

Posts: 1935 | Subs: 2



No, its a design issue, not mere opinion bias. in Coh1 you start the game with riflemen, which fight other riflemen. the one squad wins, which uses cover and the optimal range of their weapons. The next step is an armored vehicle, which can´t be killed by rifles or improving your infantry by buying veterancy or better equipemnt. It costs alot of ressources though, so its a high risk, but high reward tech.
The enemy can counter armored vehicles by teching for AT weapons. As the game goes along, you tech for heavier armored vehicles (tanks), which require better AT weapons. A good mix of AT/AI normally will win you the game, if you dont loose units.
In coh2 you have an atgun (hardcounter!) from the start and you can build a late game vehicle in early game. There is no tech choice anymore, thus no variety. You already have everything, which makes the game boring.

I get what you're going for but its not entirely true. AT guns come way too early I agree with that part. But the mid-late game vehicle pacing is pretty similar to coh1 unless you are counting Kubelwagen as light armor lol. The problem is quite the opposite really, not enough of the back and forth with mid-late game tech because call-in tanks break that aspect of the game.
6 Jul 2015, 10:16 AM
#73
avatar of Trubbbel

Posts: 670

I accidently got coh2 when i buyed the humble bundle. I played alpha and beta before, so i was quite curious what has changed.
Once i started the game, i was welcomed with [this and that, new stuff]

wtf??

In coh1 you had...

Yes *sigh*. It's a new game you know. Things changed and you didn't give it a chance, it has plenty of improvements. If you want Everything like Coh1, that game already exists. And you should be happy.
6 Jul 2015, 13:32 PM
#74
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419


Yes *sigh*. It's a new game you know. Things changed and you didn't give it a chance, it has plenty of improvements. If you want Everything like Coh1, that game already exists. And you should be happy.


You quoted me, but you didnt read. I played alpha, beta and the free weekend offers, before i finally got the game by humble bundle. Plenty of chance for the game to convinve me. I do not criticize the balance, but the design. Issues, which im afraid will not be fixed ever.
Because of these, i dont like coh2.
Please name me some improvments. Its not a troll question, im really curious.
regards
6 Jul 2015, 14:22 PM
#75
avatar of Erguvan

Posts: 273



Please name me some improvments. Its not a troll question, im really curious.
regards


The only TrueSight feature is enough for me to leave CoH1

And there are some other nice things such as directional cover, diverse units, deadly co-axial and hull guns, more necessity to have weapon support units (hmg, mortar) and tooo many option to deal with armors from at infantries to heavy assault guns.. these are the first things that come to my mind
6 Jul 2015, 14:36 PM
#76
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419



The only TrueSight feature is enough for me to leave CoH1

And there are some other nice things such as directional cover, diverse units, deadly co-axial and hull guns, more necessity to have weapon support units (hmg, mortar) and tooo many option to deal with armors from at infantries to heavy assault guns.. these are the first things that come to my mind


Truesight is not an improvment.

All the other stuff you named already existed in coh1.
6 Jul 2015, 15:08 PM
#77
avatar of Erguvan

Posts: 273



Truesight is not an improvment.


GG WP

good luck in coh1
6 Jul 2015, 16:41 PM
#78
avatar of HolyUnlyrical_Lyrics

Posts: 120

Permanently Banned
I loved coh1, especially Vcoh. Yet the one thing I will never ever want to get back in to is the obnoxious invisible sniper spam (vet 3 US sniper anyone?). The only thing coh2 does better in my book is snipers, that is pretty much it.

Coh2 will never become wat coh1 was, not in a million years xd
6 Jul 2015, 17:41 PM
#79
avatar of AvNY

Posts: 857



You quoted me, but you didnt read. I played alpha, beta and the free weekend offers, before i finally got the game by humble bundle. Plenty of chance for the game to convinve me. I do not criticize the balance, but the design. Issues, which im afraid will not be fixed ever.
Because of these, i dont like coh2.
Please name me some improvments. Its not a troll question, im really curious.
regards



I am a huge fan of COH1 and still prefer to play it over COH2 (which I purchased).

There are certainly improvements in COH1 over COH2 though if you only play COH1 you probably feel you don't need them.

- Reverse on vehicles.
- being able to see all your units at the same time, including their status and health.
- getting increased experience for killing vetted (higher value) units.
- Trusight. You may not be into this, but here is one change that INCREASED strategic and tactical depth to the game.
- Snow/mud. This is certainly an technological improvement. But it is very dependent on how effectively it is implemented in maps. If it adds too much complexity to balancing a map, well... use less of it.
- NO SNIPER META! (Even now that I have learned much better to use these, snipers still feel like they break the flow/feel of COH1.)

Also COH2 has battle servers with some hacking detection. Currently in COH1 maphacking just isn't an issue. Partly because the game became irrelevant so no one codes them.

This is about real improvements, not the things we don't like as COH1 fans. The test is if you were playing with these features for a long while, would you then miss them if you went back to COH1.
6 Jul 2015, 20:09 PM
#80
avatar of Trubbbel

Posts: 670

Units arriving off-map.

There was also a thread about this, to remind everyone of how much improvements really is in Coh2. It came up with alot of things. But if the improvements are not actually considered improvements then I guess you win.
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