About the B-4
16 Nov 2014, 21:16 PM
#281
Posts: 117
And buff kv1 penetration and damage to make up for that nerf.
16 Nov 2014, 21:29 PM
#282
Posts: 292
http://www.coh2.org/replay/27063/b4-1-shot
Here's the proof. Also streamed while filming.
Warp to 20m
This is still incorrect, you are using FMR at the same time.
In a normal game, are you always that lucky to have a JT/KT standing still and you know where it is, at the same time having 190 munition available?
My point still stands, THE B4 CAN NOT ONE SHOT SUPER HEAVY TANKS ON ITS OWN.
You can compare it to how ridiculous the Jagdtiger becomes with a Command Panther and its mark vehicle. It two shots every tank the allies have except the IS2/ISU. It even one shots Jacksons.
Ade, mein liebes Schätzelein
16 Nov 2014, 21:31 PM
#283
Posts: 322
This is still incorrect, you are using FMR at the same time.
In a normal game, are you always that lucky to have a JT/KT standing still and you know where it is, at the same time having 190 munition available?
My point still stands, THE B4 CAN NOT ONE SHOT SUPER HEAVY TANKS ON ITS OWN.
I never made the claim it would do it on its own I made the claim it would do it without assistance from another doctrine.
Even so you can't be seriously trying to justify a 1 shot to the heaviest vehicle in coh2.
16 Nov 2014, 23:03 PM
#284
Posts: 403
You act like everytime it fires its going to hit a JT (or something).
Have you ever used the unit before?
Have you ever used the unit before?
Major Conscript user.
Sometimes NKVD Commander.
Sometimes NKVD Commander.
16 Nov 2014, 23:13 PM
#285
Posts: 967
It's easier to remove it's vet 3 then actually killed it, just kill the crew and it it will lose its vet bonus. No need to nerf anything here, move on.
Thanks.
Thanks.
VoltarDark
Long live to COH2, the king of all team RTS !
Long live to COH2, the king of all team RTS !
17 Nov 2014, 00:19 AM
#286
Posts: 2070
You act like everytime it fires its going to hit a JT (or something).
Have you ever used the unit before?
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
17 Nov 2014, 00:53 AM
#287
Posts: 503
This is still incorrect, you are using FMR at the same time.
In a normal game, are you always that lucky to have a JT/KT standing still and you know where it is, at the same time having 190 munition available?
My point still stands, THE B4 CAN NOT ONE SHOT SUPER HEAVY TANKS ON ITS OWN.
You can compare it to how ridiculous the Jagdtiger becomes with a Command Panther and its mark vehicle. It two shots every tank the allies have except the IS2/ISU. It even one shots Jacksons.
are you sure? cmmd-panthers concentrated fire is 45munitions (not 80 like mark vehicle) and is supposed to buff accuracy not damage... ive read various claims that it buffs dmg by 50%... yet the ability description says otherwise
but then you barely play the game...
17 Nov 2014, 00:55 AM
#288
Posts: 2053
u sure? cmmd-panthers concentrated fire is 45munitions (not 80 like mark vehicle) and is supposed to buff accuracy not damage... ive read various claims that it buffs dmg by 50%... yet the ability description says otherwise.
It actually does do slightly more damage to the marked target. Unless it underwent a ninja change...
I did test the command panther on IS-2's and the IS-2 definitely took more damage when marked.
But the command panther itself can only mark, and i believe that ability has a radius.
17 Nov 2014, 01:03 AM
#289
Posts: 503
It actually does do slightly more damage to the marked target. Unless it underwent a ninja change...
I did test the command panther on IS-2's and the IS-2 definitely took more damage when marked.
But the command panther itself can only mark, and i believe that ability has a radius.
what the heck... why cant they put that in the units description then? i was always like "meh. im going to hit that isu anyways why mark it for increased accuracy"
17 Nov 2014, 01:24 AM
#290
Posts: 658
i was thinking to make post about b4,fortunately some guys did it.i wanna say to relic to fix b4 as its value.coh2 is a strategy game and the game of macro but some weapons like b4 disturb it,it can easily destroy anything(squad,tanks,heavy tanks,building) without macro or game play like isu!my suggestion is decrease its damage or available it at least 10cp and 100fuel to build it.....
17 Nov 2014, 11:40 AM
#291
Posts: 322
It actually does do slightly more damage to the marked target. Unless it underwent a ninja change...
I did test the command panther on IS-2's and the IS-2 definitely took more damage when marked.
But the command panther itself can only mark, and i believe that ability has a radius.
35% isn't 'slightly more' that a pretty huge damage increase, If you ever played a MMO 35% increase to your class is normally on a 10 min+ cooldown because it can swing raid fights in such a profound way.
17 Nov 2014, 11:47 AM
#292
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Why are we even discussing markt target since it's two-edged sword.
Damaged boost for Allies.
Warning for Axis.
Mark Target does not work with B-4 unless you face newbie.
It works only if you get deep behind enemy line and you are surrounded.
B4 3vet is less OP than Jadgtiger shooting through houses, forests and stuff like that.
Hitting anything moving is really hard. It's not like clikc-hit, it's more like click-miss vs decent player.
Damaged boost for Allies.
Warning for Axis.
Mark Target does not work with B-4 unless you face newbie.
It works only if you get deep behind enemy line and you are surrounded.
B4 3vet is less OP than Jadgtiger shooting through houses, forests and stuff like that.
Hitting anything moving is really hard. It's not like clikc-hit, it's more like click-miss vs decent player.
17 Nov 2014, 14:15 PM
#293
Posts: 196
Hitting anything moving is really hard. It's not like clikc-hit, it's more like click-miss vs decent player.
Not with how slow and sluggish the worthwhile targets are.
17 Nov 2014, 14:21 PM
#294
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Not with how slow and sluggish the worthwhile targets are.
I cant agree with you because there is about 5secs from firing to hit. Add rotation time and po have plenty time to move Jadgtiger few meters. Once you notice shot you have 60sec of peace. After you just have to watch out and move juicy targets. I have no problems with b4 as Axis but maybe because im using it and i know how to deal with it.
17 Nov 2014, 14:30 PM
#295
Posts: 17884 | Subs: 8
Not with how slow and sluggish the worthwhile targets are.
You probably never played soviets or watched any reps and have no idea how big speed demon B-4 is when it comes to turning and aiming on something that isn't immobilized.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
17 Nov 2014, 14:35 PM
#296
Posts: 923
Didn't most people agree 5 pages back that the B-4s problem is the 50% dmg increase at vet 3?
And that this should be changed to something else?
And that this should be changed to something else?
Disclaimer: Posts made while drunk should not count against this poster.
17 Nov 2014, 15:37 PM
#297
Posts: 292
If the B4 gets nerfed the whole Counter Attack commander will never see daylight again.
Those of you who cry for a nerf, how do you suggest Allies to effectively counter Jagdtigers in the future? The B4 is already hard countered by any Ostheer player with a Stuka commander.
If the B4 gets nerfed the Axis won't have to have an Ostheer player prepared to get a commander with Stuka Bombing Strike = more Tigers. IMO a nerf to this unit will be the last nail in the coffin for Allied 3v3 + 4v4 play.
Those of you who cry for a nerf, how do you suggest Allies to effectively counter Jagdtigers in the future? The B4 is already hard countered by any Ostheer player with a Stuka commander.
If the B4 gets nerfed the Axis won't have to have an Ostheer player prepared to get a commander with Stuka Bombing Strike = more Tigers. IMO a nerf to this unit will be the last nail in the coffin for Allied 3v3 + 4v4 play.
Ade, mein liebes Schätzelein
17 Nov 2014, 16:13 PM
#298
Posts: 322
If the B4 gets nerfed the whole Counter Attack commander will never see daylight again.
Those of you who cry for a nerf, how do you suggest Allies to effectively counter Jagdtigers in the future? The B4 is already hard countered by any Ostheer player with a Stuka commander.
If the B4 gets nerfed the Axis won't have to have an Ostheer player prepared to get a commander with Stuka Bombing Strike = more Tigers. IMO a nerf to this unit will be the last nail in the coffin for Allied 3v3 + 4v4 play.
Oh just stop.
People are asking for a vet 3 nerf on it, Not nerfing the unit.
It will still be very strong, just not 1 shot capable.
17 Nov 2014, 16:27 PM
#299
Posts: 403
Oh just stop.
People are asking for a vet 3 nerf on it, Not nerfing the unit.
It will still be very strong, just not 1 shot capable.
So you never have used the unit before.
Major Conscript user.
Sometimes NKVD Commander.
Sometimes NKVD Commander.
17 Nov 2014, 16:36 PM
#300
Posts: 503
it is an okay unit and totally fine until it hits vet 3 and deals 960 dmg per shot...
in a game where unit preservation is of utmost importance and damage/HP values are delicately balanced (yeah, some might disagree about this part) a 50% dmg increase is simply over the top. especially if it affects the unit with the highest damage output per shot (yes the sturmtiger has the same damage, but nobody in his right mind ever goes for a short ranged "b4" with longer reload time and a hefty fuel cost. i do, but...).
im repeating myself here: i thought that oneshot wipes were despised by most people who care about the game, yet when its the B4 its suddenly totally fine to one shot tanks (975 dmg is enough to oneshot all but the heaviest tanks). its ability to wipe squads is fine. it is after all static and slow and who knows what... but that damage. how can you seriously defend that? oh yeah it is needed to kill JTs. that it fucks up every tank that isnt at least a tiger doesnt matter then?
same is true for buildings btw. theyre HP is set to be resilient enough to withstand some damage but not too much. the 50% increase is screwing with that, too. all for the sake of killing a single doctrinal unit.
in a game where unit preservation is of utmost importance and damage/HP values are delicately balanced (yeah, some might disagree about this part) a 50% dmg increase is simply over the top. especially if it affects the unit with the highest damage output per shot (yes the sturmtiger has the same damage, but nobody in his right mind ever goes for a short ranged "b4" with longer reload time and a hefty fuel cost. i do, but...).
im repeating myself here: i thought that oneshot wipes were despised by most people who care about the game, yet when its the B4 its suddenly totally fine to one shot tanks (975 dmg is enough to oneshot all but the heaviest tanks). its ability to wipe squads is fine. it is after all static and slow and who knows what... but that damage. how can you seriously defend that? oh yeah it is needed to kill JTs. that it fucks up every tank that isnt at least a tiger doesnt matter then?
same is true for buildings btw. theyre HP is set to be resilient enough to withstand some damage but not too much. the 50% increase is screwing with that, too. all for the sake of killing a single doctrinal unit.
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