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Proposal to increase the number of weapon slots for Rifles

23 Jul 2014, 16:05 PM
#1
avatar of S73v0

Posts: 522

I've been finding it annoying how I've managed to wipe a vetted axis squad and they drop an mg34 or a shreck and I fist pump in the air only to realise that all my squads can't pick up the weapon because I have already upgraded them.

2 weapon slots is not enough for such mainline infantry that rely so heavily on upgrades!!! I propose that it is increased to 3-4 weapon slots. In coh1 I think rifles had 4 weapon slots and they were beasts with 2 BARs and a stolen shreck. Please increase the number of weapon slots! What are everyone's thoughts on this?
23 Jul 2014, 16:07 PM
#2
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

Rifles have enough. They already have carbines rather than bolt action rifles.

The only squads that deserve more than two, IMO, are Conscripts, Volks, and Guards (for obvious reasons on the guards part)
23 Jul 2014, 16:09 PM
#3
avatar of 5trategos

Posts: 449

I think 2 is plenty already given the current power of weapon upgrades.
23 Jul 2014, 16:11 PM
#4
avatar of WiFiDi
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 3293

uh no just no. (much overpowered it would be)
23 Jul 2014, 16:12 PM
#5
avatar of KovuTalli

Posts: 332

Yes lets just buff USA Terminator squads more.... No thanks.

If it was done then the way every other squad gets their weapons would also need to be changed. You can't just let USA pick up 4 BAR/.30 cals and only let LMG grens get 1 LMG for buying it on the unit it self.

There would not be a good way to balance this with the way USA Infantry weapon upgrades work.
23 Jul 2014, 16:22 PM
#6
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

Yes lets just buff USA Terminator squads more.... No thanks.

If it was done then the way every other squad gets their weapons would also need to be changed. You can't just let USA pick up 4 BAR/.30 cals and only let LMG grens get 1 LMG for buying it on the unit it self.

There would not be a good way to balance this with the way USA Infantry weapon upgrades work.


Purchase and pickup can be seperated, I suspect.

In the same way that grenadiers have two weapon slots and can pick up another weapon if it's dropped, I suspect that weapon slots could be limited for americans to allow them to scavenge but not buy.

TBH, I'd quite like it if Rifles were only allowed one M1919 off the rack and had to fill that second slot with something found on-map, but that's just me.
23 Jul 2014, 20:55 PM
#7
avatar of S73v0

Posts: 522

Rifles have enough. They already have carbines rather than bolt action rifles.



Rifles definitely don't have enough weapon slots. There is a reason why we rarely see the bazooka upgrade. Not only because it has less effectiveness than a panzershreck but it takes up HALF the slots on a rifle, and reducing the rifle's effectiveness against infantry. For a squad to be effective AT they need at LEAST 2 bazookas which takes up all the slots so the rifle will be lackluster against infantry. Having more weapon slots let's the bazooka be used more often, also allowing more varying strategies from US players.

And what about the other 'terminator' squads? Obersoldaten, Jaeger light infantry, panzerfusiliers, falls? Rifles need BARs or lmgs to compete late game with them. Take the panzerfusilier for example... They have a 90 muni upgrade which gives them 3 G43s, US needs 120 muni to upgrade 2 BARs. And panzerfusiliers can still pick up weapons off the ground. How is this fair that they are straight up better than the only mainline infantry US has?

And this wouldn't be OP lol, if you let the US player get away with spending 180 muni on 1 rifle squad then you screwed up somewhere. But imo the browning m1919 should be nerfed to 2 weapon slots. Getting 2 on one squad is a bit excessive.
23 Jul 2014, 21:02 PM
#8
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 20:55 PMS73v0
...For a squad to be effective AT they need at LEAST 2 bazookas which takes up all the slots so the rifle will be lackluster against infantry. Having more weapon slots let's the bazooka be used more often, also allowing more varying strategies from US players....

...And what about the other 'terminator' squads? Obersoldaten, Jaeger light infantry, panzerfusiliers, falls? Rifles need BARs or lmgs to compete late game with them...


A) Why do you think rifles are so special that they deserve to be amazing at both AT and AI? Name one other squad that gets to do that. What you want is not 'varying stratergies', it's called all-purpose boring ass rifle blobs

B) Rifles are tier 0 standard infantry. They're not meant to one man duke it out with elite infantry, even with upgrades. You have lieutenants for that (Dat Thompson) in the small sense and numbers in the larger scale. It's not like conscripts fare any better against them, is it?
23 Jul 2014, 21:03 PM
#9
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17581 | Subs: 8

Definitely a big now.

They are fine the way they are with weapon slots.
23 Jul 2014, 21:40 PM
#10
avatar of S73v0

Posts: 522



A) Why do you think rifles are so special that they deserve to be amazing at both AT and AI? Name one other squad that gets to do that. What you want is not 'varying stratergies', it's called all-purpose boring ass rifle blobs

B) Rifles are tier 0 standard infantry. They're not meant to one man duke it out with elite infantry, even with upgrades. You have lieutenants for that (Dat Thompson) in the small sense and numbers in the larger scale. It's not like conscripts fare any better against them, is it?


Ummm... Rifles are the only mainline infantry US has.... Well airborne is another but they are doctrinal and I'm fine with them being anti-infantry only. Panzergrens with panzershrecks, Guards with DPs, vetted volks with panzershrecks, hell even Obersoldaten or shocks picking up a stolen shreck. Plenty of infantry that have both AI and AT. And like I said before changing weapon slots from 2 to 3 isn't going to affect much. Unless you let the US get 3*180 muni= 540+ muni all on rifle squads upgrades only then you're doing something wrong.

The other infantry that US field is Lieutenant that comes with 1 BAR and only 1 weapon slot. And captain that comes with 1 thompson and 2 bazookas and no weapon slots. So they're really not meant to duke it out with elite infantry...

I have put this proposal forth because I have had many 1v1s where I upgraded 2 weapon slots on a lot of my infantry and when the vehicles came I couldn't get bazookas because upgrading for bazookas isn't worth it for just 1 or 2. I have also found it annoying when a weapon drops I can't pick it up with the squad I have at hand and have to bring a squad from the other side of the map to pick it up. This has resulted in a lot of lost weapons to the enemy which I find frustrating. So long as there are only 2 weapon slots bazookas will continue to be under-utilized.
23 Jul 2014, 21:50 PM
#11
avatar of LAconic

Posts: 15

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 21:40 PMS73v0


Ummm... Rifles are the only mainline infantry US has.... Well airborne is another but they are doctrinal and I'm fine with them being anti-infantry only. Panzergrens with panzershrecks, Guards with DPs, vetted volks with panzershrecks, hell even Obersoldaten or shocks picking up a stolen shreck. Plenty of infantry that have both AI and AT. And like I said before changing weapon slots from 2 to 3 isn't going to affect much. Unless you let the US get 3*180 muni= 540+ muni all on rifle squads upgrades only then you're doing something wrong.

The other infantry that US field is Lieutenant that comes with 1 BAR and only 1 weapon slot. And captain that comes with 1 thompson and 2 bazookas and no weapon slots. So they're really not meant to duke it out with elite infantry...

I have put this proposal forth because I have had many 1v1s where I upgraded 2 weapon slots on a lot of my infantry and when the vehicles came I couldn't get bazookas because upgrading for bazookas isn't worth it for just 1 or 2. I have also found it annoying when a weapon drops I can't pick it up with the squad I have at hand and have to bring a squad from the other side of the map to pick it up. This has resulted in a lot of lost weapons to the enemy which I find frustrating. So long as there are only 2 weapon slots bazookas will continue to be under-utilized.


I wish obersoldaten could pick up three more lmg's off all the dead grenadier squads I see riflemen blobs melt away with a single m1919 per squad, but hey, it's a cruel cruel world, right?
23 Jul 2014, 22:23 PM
#12
avatar of steel

Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 16:05 PMS73v0
I've been finding it annoying how I've managed to wipe a vetted axis squad and they drop an mg34 or a shreck and I fist pump in the air only to realise that all my squads can't pick up the weapon because I have already upgraded them.

2 weapon slots is not enough for such mainline infantry that rely so heavily on upgrades!!! I propose that it is increased to 3-4 weapon slots. In coh1 I think rifles had 4 weapon slots and they were beasts with 2 BARs and a stolen shreck. Please increase the number of weapon slots! What are everyone's thoughts on this?
Don't think it's needed. You could always get another squad pick it up or always reserve one slot for every squad for weapons lieing on the floor. When you mentioned coh1, I remember I had my volksgrenadier stole 5 BARS. :lol:
23 Jul 2014, 22:37 PM
#13
avatar of S73v0

Posts: 522

Alright... based on the feedback how about this then?

-Rifles get 4 weapon slots
-Can only purchase a maximum of 2 each of BARs and bazookas for each squad
-Can only purchase a maximum of 1 Browning lmg for each squad
-Browning lmg takes up 2 weapon slots

Benefits:
+ Promotes usage of bazookas as emergency AT
+ Doesn't punish a US player on weapon choices. e.g. Gets bazookas early to counter a light vehicle, but when elite infantry hit the field the squad can get BARs as well to help deal with them
+ Allows rifles to pick up weapons on the battlefield more easily
23 Jul 2014, 22:38 PM
#14
avatar of OZtheWiZARD

Posts: 1439

No, no, no. Don't really have to say why.
23 Jul 2014, 23:33 PM
#15
avatar of wooof

Posts: 950 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 20:55 PMS73v0

And what about the other 'terminator' squads? Obersoldaten, Jaeger light infantry, panzerfusiliers, falls? Rifles need BARs or lmgs to compete late game with them.


how many of those squads get to have AI and AT upgrades? none of them.
23 Jul 2014, 23:51 PM
#16
avatar of theblitz6794

Posts: 395

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 22:37 PMS73v0
Alright... based on the feedback how about this then?

-Rifles get 4 weapon slots
-Can only purchase a maximum of 2 each of BARs and bazookas for each squad
-Can only purchase a maximum of 1 Browning lmg for each squad
-Browning lmg takes up 2 weapon slots

Benefits:
+ Promotes usage of bazookas as emergency AT
+ Doesn't punish a US player on weapon choices. e.g. Gets bazookas early to counter a light vehicle, but when elite infantry hit the field the squad can get BARs as well to help deal with them
+ Allows rifles to pick up weapons on the battlefield more easily

I kinda love this. Well, I love the theory here. Needs tweaking though and it needs to be extrapolated to conscripts, volks, ect. I don't know how or in what ways, but please continue this and post about it further. This is a good start
24 Jul 2014, 01:32 AM
#17
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 22:37 PMS73v0
Alright... based on the feedback how about this then?

-Rifles get 4 weapon slots
-Can only purchase a maximum of 2 each of BARs and bazookas for each squad
-Can only purchase a maximum of 1 Browning lmg for each squad
-Browning lmg takes up 2 weapon slots

Benefits:
+ Promotes usage of bazookas as emergency AT
+ Doesn't punish a US player on weapon choices. e.g. Gets bazookas early to counter a light vehicle, but when elite infantry hit the field the squad can get BARs as well to help deal with them
+ Allows rifles to pick up weapons on the battlefield more easily


Reduce it to 3 weapon slots.
You can only purchase 2 weapons.

Basically like most of the other infantry squads in the game.
24 Jul 2014, 04:38 AM
#18
avatar of ThoseDeafMutes

Posts: 1026

The OP is being sarcastic, in case nobody else noticed.
24 Jul 2014, 04:50 AM
#19
avatar of braciszek

Posts: 2053

The OP is being sarcastic, in case nobody else noticed.


Ahhhhhhhh.... ok. I thought someone genuinely went bonkers and thought USF infantry should be only equipped with LMG's. The bazooka thing is an excuse.
24 Jul 2014, 04:53 AM
#20
avatar of FestiveLongJohns
Patrion 15

Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post23 Jul 2014, 16:05 PMS73v0
I've been finding it annoying how I've managed to wipe a vetted axis squad and they drop an mg34 or a shreck and I fist pump in the air only to realise that all my squads can't pick up the weapon because I have already upgraded them.

2 weapon slots is not enough for such mainline infantry that rely so heavily on upgrades!!! I propose that it is increased to 3-4 weapon slots. In coh1 I think rifles had 4 weapon slots and they were beasts with 2 BARs and a stolen shreck. Please increase the number of weapon slots! What are everyone's thoughts on this?


The thought of putting 3 M1919s on a single rifle squad is absurd. IMO 2 is fine, any more and people will just stack insane amounts of DPS on a single squad and use it to squad wipe at will.
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