Profile of pigsoup

Jump back to quoted post8 May 2014, 01:34 AMVolsky

None of you, sans Kat, seem to grasp the point.

It doesn't matter if a unit costs, say, 9999 Fuel. It's still broken as all hell if this imaginary unit could 1-shot your base with impunity from across the map, and then even if you got to attacking it, it was incredibly easy to keep alive.

Both the Elefant and ISU are bad, bad concepts. Kiting was a big thing in vCoH; proper M10 and Firefly micro could drop a nice shit into anyone's bowl of cornflakes. But 100 range units? Why not give us auto-fire howitzers? It's a bad idea, and the FlaK 88/36 was feared because of its ability. But the FlaK 88 was also immobile, almost defenseless against infantry, could be destroyed with little effort (except the part where it regularly bounces non-upgunned Sherman shots) and it could be de-crewed and turned against its original owner.

None of those statements can be leveled at the Elefant or ISU, and on top of that, both of these derp units can spot for themselves.

If we dropped the range to 60-75 and worked from there I think both units would be fine. For those of you wondering, the ISU-152's standard APHE shell could penetrate something on the order of 150ish mm 105mm of armor at any range (due to the 'HE' in APHE). However, because it's an effing howitzer on treads, it wasn't incredibly accurate and was often used in batteries of 5 vehicles to pour shells into an area to ensure that the target, whatever it was, was good and dead. On top of this, each vehicle could only carry 14 rounds of ammunition and separate powder bags (propellant), and because of the separate shell and charge, even the most experienced crews could coax a 30 second reload out of the gun.

My fix idea would therefore be to keep the gun's power as is, increase the scatter values (I don't have the numbers with me right now, but I'll try and find them) and reload time. It has a meh chance of hitting you, but if it does, it hits like a Mac truck.

As for the Elefant, it just needs a range and armor (or health) reduction. If it's range and health, you just need to hope to god your opponent doesn't get a lucky pen roll (so using it as LEL unkillable troll deathstar would get it dead in short order). It can deflect most rounds, but if it gets penetrated, it hurts. That would encourage pouring much AT into it as possible, because sooner or later you're going to penetrate it and that's going to sting.

EDIT: Here's the pen tables I'm working with, used as part of a realism mod I'm working on in vCoH, with proceeding example of what everything means:


1st value (millimeters of penetration at 100m) = (percentage of total penetrating power; example below)
2nd value (millimeters of penetration at 500m) = (percentage of total penetrating power; example below)
3rd value (millimeters of penetration at 1000m) = (percentage of total penetrating power; example below)
4th value (millimeters of penetration at 1500m) = (percentage of total penetrating power; example below)

P4 L43 75mm
(PzGr 39 (APCBC)
99 = 1 (99mm is the maximum rated penetrating power, so: 99 ÷ 99 = 1 (100% of total penetrating power)
91 = 0.919 (99mm is the maximum rated penetrating power, so: 91 ÷ 99 = 0.919 (91.9% of total penetrating power)
82 = 0.828 (99mm is the maximum rated penetrating power, so: 82 ÷ 99 = 0.828 (82.8% of total penetrating power)
71 = 0.717 (99mm is the maximum rated penetrating power, so: 71 ÷ 99 = 0.717 (71.7% of total penetrating power)

152mm M-1937 ML-20 L/28.8
(BR-540 (APHE)
105 = 1
105 = 1
105 = 1
105 = 1

For reference, the APHE shell of the T-34 obr 1942 (T-34/76), from the same document:

76.2mm F-34 L/41.5
(BR-365 (APHE)
90 = 1
69 = 0.767
61 = 0.678
56 = 0.617

Jump back to quoted post7 May 2014, 16:04 PMCardboard Tank

Since the patch I always go Tiger/ Elefant combo in 2v2 as Germans.

Usually I´ll mix in a StuG or two on the way to the CPs.

The two times I did build T4 the Panther was obliterated by Su-85s it couldn´t reach or Sherman-spam. With a Panther that has less range than the Russian tank hunter and less health than pre patch, is more expensive and can´t blitz and a nerfed Panzerwerfer there is no reason any longer to go T4 instead of Tiger or Elefant. Honestly German T4 is a joke.

Jump back to quoted post4 May 2014, 01:52 AMDanielD

I've heard it argued that if Hitler hadn't been indecisive during the initial phase of the push into Russia, the Red Army may have been smashed for good. What does this have to do with the ISU?