People have problems with KV-8 because they insist on countering them with Panzer Greandiers. Any tank will deal with KV-8 with ease. KV-8 literally tickles PzIV with its gun. I had a match in which I had 1 PzIV against 3 KV-8 and destroyed them all.
KV-8 killing units instantly its a flame mechanics issue, not a problem with KV-8 itself. Flame halftruck can do the same.
Even in this topic you can find replies like: " I can only take one shot on KV-8 before it melts my PG. OP unit" and that's the real issue here. You aren't supposed to come near KV-8 with infantry at all because you will be punish for that. It's a anti infantry unit and it excels in what it does. I'd say that Brumbar is more powerful with some nice anti tank potential as well.
im going to have to disagree. flame crits certainly make the kv8 and the flame ht strong (all flamers for that matter) but the real issue is the 40 damage it does. even ignoring crits, it takes 2 seconds to kill an entity. if the squad is close together, it could kill the entire squad in 2 seconds. inf also die that fast while retreating. thats ignoring crits which can only make it faster. i agree people should not be fighting kv8s with grens or pgrens. but that doesnt change how powerful a kv8 is.
as for your game where you killed 3 with 1 p4, that just sounds like bad play by the soviet. theres no reason to build 3 kv8s. build 1 and then have 2 su85s. now your 1 p4 is competely screwed. if a soviet OR a german builds no AT, hell get beat by 1 tank. so that example is kind of irrelevant. if it really was a good game, id like to see the replay to see how it all happened. |
yea it reminded me of strafing run too. not sure how some people can still claim it sucks. it searches for targets now so aiming is no longer an issue and who needs suppression when you can melt multiple squads at once. just be happy they increased the cooldown. for a while in beta, the cooldown was the length of the loiter. back to back il-2s is not fun.
i never use the german strafe but i think it costs 120 munitions? so i guess it wont be quite as common as strafe. but still could end up being an issue. honestly i raised the point that i thought it might be too strong back in beta, but relic went live with it anyway. |
Interesting point,I thought that if it was such an urgent matter they would do something about it...so next month until KV-8 nerf then?
i didnt say that either. i said just because a kv8 change wasnt made doesnt necessarily mean its balanced. i cant speak for relic as to why they didnt put out the mg changes sooner, but my guess is they wanted to keep testing it longer. i think most people are pretty happy with the changes, so i think waiting until they had a good fix was the right thing to do. if they released a rushed patch the fix the mg and broke things even more, people would have been pissed. i guess people were pissed having to wait too, but you cant make everyone happy. i know another part of the delay is they want to see how the game changed from the last patch. you cant put out balance patches too often, it would become hard to tell what youre doing to the game. |
Perhaps wooof, but its survival is still far less than Maxim, and its more vulnerable, due to slower de-setup, meaning it has to soak more damage for longer before it can gtfo.
So whats the relative suppression rate now?
How fast does a Maxim suppress a Gren, vs how fast does a MG42 suppress a Con?
well the changes hit the maxim and mg42 equally. compared to each other, the are still the same. youre right it will soak up more damage before being able to run though. if you pay attention, i think you can still keep them alive without too much trouble though. i have to do a little bit of testing to verify these numbers, but i think this table is accurate. if its not, dont blame me, milkacow made it im trusting his work.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApmrrrPr20ncdEpuSHcxNko1VGVFYjczYXpFZWhqOHc#gid=6
oh and by the way, its actually 4/5 the survival. 1/1.25 =80% |
It appears that KV-8 isn't OP judging by the last patch,if it was then it would've been changed otherwise,no?
not necessarily true. they dont change everything in 1 patch. relic still knows there are things wrong with the game. it wont all get changed at the same time though. too many changes can lead to problems, plus relic needs time to make and test the changes.
just look at this latest patch. they knew the mg was broken for almost a month. pqumsieh announced the mg changes were coming on the stream in auguest. they still didnt release it at that time, even though they were actually done already. |
Well six Mosin Nagants are a strong as four Kar-98s, but isn't having six of them a disadvantage here? I mean when you match up a Grenadier in same cover as a Conscript against each other, and just let them fire away at each other, it's most likely that the first model to die is a conscript one. At that point there are 5 Mosin Nagants against 4 Kar 98s, so the Grenadiers will actually have higher DPS at this point. The question is if this will be enough of a difference for the Grenadiers to gain and hold some DPS momentum. If the 2nd conscript dies about at the same time as (or sooner than) the 1st grenadier, then the grenadiers will effectively have had more DPS than the conscript, leading them to win the engagement in the end.
Now the question is of course what really does happen, RNG makes this a little complex. Would love to see some tests on this, but until then I tend to think Grenadiers are at the advantage here.
relic has said they already tested this extensively. this was with the old stats (before these latest gren changes) but it was essentially 50/50. i cant find the post that talked about this, but heres another one that shows the time to kill is very even. it really comes down to RNG.
At near range, 0 - 10 units, a Conscript takes on average 31.53s to kill a Grenadier squad. Similarly, a Grenadier squad takes 31.58s. However, if you take the absolute values the time is nearly identical, rounding resulted in the minor discrepancy.
|
ill just use 4 for pak and 6 for zis since theyre nice round numbers. 6 is 50% more than 4. 4 is 2/3 of 6 meaning its 33% less. 50% more means 50% slower since it takes 50% longer to shoot. 33% less time means pak shoots 33% faster.
it just depends which way you compare it. |
I dunno what the chance is, but my impression from the Devs is that it basically doesn't matter what side you throw the AT Nade from, its the same chance to hit rear.
i dont think so. it has to do with the way its thrown in an arc. the faust flies straight so it hits whatever side youre on. the nade can arc up and over. it should work from either side. throwing from the back should be able to hit the front. |
no its not shit. nowhere near as godly as before. still very useable though. just have to pay more attention. id say the traverse is one of the bigger changes that happened |
moscow winter |