There's no way CoH2 will ever be achieve mainstream success as an eSport. Over two years past release the game is imo the best it's ever been but the buzz surrounding it is gone.
There is perhaps some scope for it to achieve niche success, although there are many factors counting against that as the OP mentioned.
RNG is a big subject of debate. I think such a feature can enhance the esports potential by creating variety and uncertainty. However when entire games are frequently decided by one or two moments of RNG it's too much. Often when two players of similar skill play each other, the game comes down to who had better luck rather than who played that little bit better. |
I voted yes. Against a decent player it's not terribly OP but there are a few issues.
The most obvious problem in my eyes is the health is too high. The fragility of the katyusha & panzerwerfer mean that they require you to be careful how you use them lest they be destroyed, or if the opponent really wants they can do a suicide run to take the unit out (although they will likely be behind in fuel on the trade).
The walking stuka on the other hand has twice the health of those vehicles and the extra armour means small arms aren't an easy way to kill it. It doesn't help immersion when two otherwise very similar halftracks have such different levels of durability.
The second problem is the squad wiping potential. While it's true that in 1v1 you can dodge it fairly easily, it gets harder in 2v2 and above where you can't easily tell what it's firing at and the busier battlespace makes it easier to miss the firing sound. Thus as the game goes on, the unit will continue to wipe squads.
The third issue is how quickly it can be built. Again this isn't an issue in 1v1 because rushing the unit would be hard countered by a light tank/armoured car, but in 2v2+ it enables you to get it out early because your opponent can cover the shortfalls you leave. It doesn't seem right that such a potentially lethal unit comes this early, it feels much more like a late-game unit to me.
I'm not suggesting that all 3 of these things get addressed at once, that would probably push the unit into obscurity and further reduce the options OKW has mid-game. However if one was addressed (ideally the HP issue) it would be a good step forward. |
Volks aren't that bad, there are only two issues that need to be addressed:
1. Right now Volks take forever to vet up without upgrades but get to vet 5 super fast with the panzershrek. Some adjustment needs to be made to reduce this effect. If volks get to max vet in line with other basic infantry it would help discourage blobbing because losing a squad with mid-high vet is more of a setback.
2. The panzershrek has a significant chance to kill infantry, sometimes even multiple models at once. Thus the squad doesn't lose much effectiveness against infantry, in fact it indirectly gains it when you take into account the vet preivously mentioned. There really isn't any thought that goes into purchasing the shrek, especially since with many doctrines OKW ends up floating munitions with nothing to spend it on. |
They have some similar units but their play style is very different. Ostheer is all about combined arms, your success depends on how well you use your units together. The flipside of that is they don't have any one really strong unit that can carry the battle by itself. Compared to the other factions they have a conservative, defensive playstyle more built around maintaining map control and grinding down the opponent.
OKW don't have the same unit synergy as Ostheer, instead they are all about using a few really strong units aggressively. They aren't as well rounded as Ostheer but they excel in infantry and armour.
Right now OKW are maybe a touch 'stronger' and easier to play, but it won't be that way forever (we hope). I'd start playing with Ostheer, you'll get a better feel for the game and learn good habits rather than some bad ones (Blobbing...) you might pick up with OKW. Regardless of your preferred faction it helps to play the opposites as well, that way you better learn their strengths,weaknesses and tech structure while also getting exposed to different methods of playing your preferred faction. |
It comes down to how people define 'realism' and think it should be represented in the game. It's easy to get misled into thinking CoH2 is a historically accurate game because of the good graphics, smooth animations and fluff text in-game. But what CoH2 is really about is immersion or 'soft' realism, i.e. the game feels real and is consistent within the rules set out in its own universe. In that sense the goal is to represent the strengths, weaknesses and operational styles of the factions and units in the game, rather than making sure the effective range of a K98 is mirrored exactly in-game.
So with that in mind players are willing to accept obvious inaccuracies (e.g. soldiers being blind beyond 50m or artillery fire arriving directly on target within seconds) as long as the game remains consistent with its own established rules. However, there comes a point when things are just too silly and obviously unrealistic, which is why things like blobbing and the old panzer blitz had a negative reaction from players.
Those who desire 'hard' realism, i.e. battles should play out similar to how they did historically and the performance of units should match what one could expect in real life. Usually these people only want realism when it suits them, e.g. they cry foul when their panther can't one shot shermans but have no problem with a platoon's worth of infantry charging into battle shoulder-to-shoulder and sweeping all opposition aside. In these cases there is a need to point out how asking for hard realism in one area of the game doesn't make sense given how many unrealistic aspects (sight/firing ranges, unit requisition mechanics etc.) currently exist.
There's also the uncanny valley effect, wherein the more realistic you try to make the game, the more players will notice those aspects of the game which are unrealistic. All the silly and poorly-written fluff text doesn't help either.
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Just a standard Relic overnerf. Something is overperforming so instead of giving a small adjustment to bring it back in line it gets nerfed into uselessness. |
I agree that LMGs are a bit of an issue in that they don't have much in the way of drawbacks and lead to less interesting gameplay. I don't see why M1919s in particular are an issue though. They're doctrinal and expensive (compare the performance of one M1919 to an LMG42 or LMG34), and given how much USF relies on munitions you can't just spam them without consequence. OKW and Ostheer both have effective blob counters. So yes there are some problems with M1919s, but not more than LMGs on any other faction.
Another minor thing is that they make BARs pointless. Lowering the cost of the BAR would solve that, but would give riflemen a buff they don't need right now. The BAR could use a look at, possibly make some changes to give it a more offensive/assault role.
I don't mind the idea of a slight setup time for LMGs, maybe similar to DoW1 with heavy bolters etc. The unit can still move freely, they just need to wait in place a short time in order to fire.
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Thread: Luchs19 Dec 2015, 09:20 AM
I agree that having a research requirement for shreks & nades, and/or tying each to a separate truck would put the Luchs in a better place. Right now OKW don't have to make nearly as many early game sacrifices as other factions to get their light tank on the field.
The Luchs is also a bit strong against Brits and Soviet T1, those things could use a look at to address that issue. |
the US and OKW both can get their light tank at around the same time they both get decent anti-tank capabilities themselves.
the light tank have 400 hp for a reason. It is to give them durability and longevity in the face of anti-tank.
Light tanks are strong enough to take a few hits from early game AT, but fragile enough that they take a high amount of micro to use. Yes, if you're facing a decent player your t2 AT options will struggle to finish off their light tank but they are sufficient to keep them at bay until heavier units can arrive to render that light tank worthless.
I still don't get your argument, what change are you proposing? That the 222 can counter units which are more expensive, arrive later, and have more impact on teching? That Ostheer t2 can hard-counter light tanks pointless and bring back the days of everyone stalling with low-tier units straight into late-game tanks and callins? |
There's more to it than just stats. The first issue is what the MGs are actually fighting against. Grenadier rifle grenades can easily dispatch MGs even in frontal assaults. Thus the effectiveness of MGs in controlling infantry is greatly reduced when the enemy's most numerous unit has an effective tool for countering them. USF smoke nades also seriously neuter axis MGs but aren't such a problem because they still require you to assault the MG, rather than simply sweeping it from the field. An idea which has been floated around for a while now is to reduce the range of rifle nades on suppressed units; I think that is a pretty good idea.
An issue specific to the .50cal is the point where it enters the game. By the time the .50 is available your opponent may have mortars, snipers, grenades, flamethrowers, light vehicles etc. A key factor to the effectiveness of the MG42 is it is available at a time when the opponent doesn't have any safe way of countering it.
MGs are good against OKW in the early game, but as the game goes on and the green cover is depleted, volks blobs are able to out-damage MGs sitting in yellow or no cover. It is in this scenario MG suppression does appear to be lacking, although this affects axis MGs just as much.
Given the design philosophy of USF as a mobile, offensive faction I don't think they really need a more effective area-denial MG. I'd be interested in seeing some changes made to the .50 to make it more effective as an offensive tool to support advancing infantry. Yes, I know that isn't realistic but then neither is anything at this point. An alternative more palatable to the realism crowd would be to increase its range (and possibly pen, although light vehicles have a hard enough time as is) while retaining the limited firing cone. The only way it will be able to function as a blob-counter is if you address the issues with infantry covered above. |