So bars are terrible, you pay 60 munitions for hardly any benifit, but just how bad are they compared to other upgrades?
I am going to list dps numbers and state how much more effective a unit becomes after buying an upgrade at their intended role(close range, long range ect.) its understood that there are other consequences to upgrades but i'm just looking at how much better your unit will become at what you want them to do
Obers
32 DPS Close range with an LMG
64 DPS with an STG
100% increase in damage for 90 munitions
Grens
8 DPS long range vanilla
14 DPS with LMG
75% increase in damage for 60 munitions
Grens
20 DPS vanilla close
32 DPS with G43s close
60% increase in damage 45 munitions
Rifleman BARs
30 DPS at range 5
34 DPS at range 5 (1 BAR)
38 DPS at range 5 (2 BAR)
13% Increase in damage for 60 munitions. <-------------
26% Increase in damage for 120 munitions <-------------
m1919s
7.5 DPS max range
14 DPS increase at max range 1 lmg
86% Increase in damage for 70 munitions
PPSH cons
18 DPS
33 DPS
83% increase in damage for 40 munitions
I know The devs at relic use math to balance this game, How can spending 60 munitions on a 13% DPS increase possibly be balanced at all when compared to other munitions based upgrades in the game?
Anybody think BARS need a buff or a nerf or a change?
Edit:
G43s on Panzergrenadiers actually make them worse from ranges 0-29, and barely add any dps past that range so that is the worst upgrade not BARs...b/c it makes your unit worse just skipped over it b/c i forgot it existed since only the AI ever gets it
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Post History of Hon3ynuts
Thread: Bars are the worst upgrade in the game.17 Sep 2014, 23:26 PM
In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Kubel counterplay17 Sep 2014, 17:12 PM
I don't think this is an end all solution, but i just think it would both more give ways to mitigate kubel damage and take out the kubel, which is sorely needed in the current meta Also irregardless of the kubel is it so hard to ask for 0 cps on a fricken sandbag ability In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Kubel counterplay17 Sep 2014, 15:05 PM
I think the kubel problem is that the USF cannot counter the kubel with riflemen which is of course all they can build at the start. If they decreased the CP requirements on rifleman field defenses do 0 cps than i think all three abilities wouldd help alot in beating kubelwagens. It makes sense that sandbags(volks get from the start) Fighting positions(REs get from the start) and Light at mines(AEs get from the start) could come at 0 cps since all the abilities are available vs the start. All three abilities would aid in the countering of kubel wagens by rifles If OKW has to wait for 1 cp for a machine gun please give the USF their piles of dirt at 0 cps In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Appealing and imbalances of 4v417 Sep 2014, 04:57 AM
A. It's much less stressful to play 4v4 than 1v1,the pressure isn't just on you and the action is going to be more condensed and less chaotic than in a 1v1. Also you can pull off really big plays in fights when you go help a teammate and you can really feel like you made a massive impact when you do B. Obviously Axis OP, they win every game, primarily because they win the first couple engagements and snowball into the mid/late game here are some of the reasons why 1.The USF can only build infantry initially which can be shut down easily by a kubel or 1/2 well placed mgs. Putting them in a hole which exponentially expands as their units fail to scale into the late game. 2. Additionally sturmpios will be able to push the Axis front line and cap the contested points first giving an early lead. 3. Soviets are restricted to going snipers or maxims, conscripts are an instant loss especially with a USF teammate. Their infantry is just subpar to their axis counterparts but lategame they can still compete with their effective tanks and shock troops. 4. The USF midgame still struggles against campy play due to their lack of effective indirect fire. Pack howitzer is a large risk unreliable and also countered easily by a stuka with its crazy reinforce cost. Then late game you can get priests which are effective but this is at the cost of a tank force. 5. In short the axis seem to have a distinct early game advantage in this mode nowdays for whatever reason just an observation This is ridicuolous because they also have a late game advantage(at least true when vsing the USF) Also the USF lacks the firepower to dislodge campy play in the midgame. C. Lots of maps are too cramped to flank and too punishing to retreat on, it takes a long time to go back to base then get back into the fight on large 4v4 maps. This hurts the USF especially who rely on brute force rather than support weapons. D. Many of the issues are with the USF being too weak. They don't have any variety of units at all in the start, so the Axis can just hard counter riflemen to win. The Soviets also have to rely on somewhat "cheesy" strats which limit their mobility and restrict them from aiding teammates. These complaints are similar to the 1v1 balance problems that currently exist so i feel that just balancing 1v1 and 2v2 will sufice to fix this mode of play. As i understand it OKW only wins slightly more 4v4s than they win 2v2s so even if their a little OP thats ok,but right now the mode is strait up unplayable. One thing i will qualify is that the fewer allied players may result in more noobs being on allied teams and them losing more b/c of it. But there may be few allied players b/c they are underpowered in the first place. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Fallschirmjager 17 Sep 2014, 04:06 AM
So you would rather they buy the cheaper and much better obersoldaten? Unit is overpriced by a large margin for the call in so unless you do alot with it they aren't worth getting. Especially vs USF, though i believe they perform adequatley vs the soviets A very accurate point i will agree on however is that it's dumb how relic devised this whole paratrooper system when popping out of buildings is a million times better. Also you can click on a building in the fog of war and if it turns red theres an enemy inside so you dont need this call in check In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Grens vs riflemen16 Sep 2014, 20:16 PM
Statsictics say rifles should win b/c of their cost and role which makes sense, however pio cost 40 extra manpower and the t1 building costs 80 manpower so the Ostheer player is disadvantaged in the first fight b/c of these additional costs b/c it will be 3 grens vs 3 rifles. which isn't fair However after you get your first lmg grens obliterate rifles even if they have a bar especially if the grens are vetted, even though they cost more. This also isn't fair. The balance between these units is silly and really hurts the matchup as both players are disadvantaged during different phases of the game because of them, needs to be fixed for the sake of USF and ostheer players everywhere |
Thread: Just some stats16 Sep 2014, 13:17 PM
Nobodys asking for perfection, but the fact that the axis players are winning 25-30% more games on average is ridiculously imbalanced and deffinatley needs to be fixed in some capacity. Team games are less fun playing both factions nowdays. Before WFA Axis won mabye 5% more games than allies if that at all In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Hashtag #Esports16 Sep 2014, 02:37 AM
#Kubelmeta In: Replays |
Thread: New Soviet Commander: Tank Hunter Tactics 15 Sep 2014, 18:02 PM
I think this commander could be viable with penal spam then getting cons later instead of AT guns, only it depends on how effective the penal spam is and would be munitions intensive, mabye need a cache or to control both points all game But that sounds hard and risky so ill probably just stick to call in tanks which clearly work well. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: 4v415 Sep 2014, 13:37 PM
From my experience, most players will simply stop paying for infantry after a certain point and simply churn out heavies as fast as they can. Manpower comes easy since as long as the players are cautious they can have their heavies do most the fighting while having very little bleed to resources. While those relying on tanks like the T34/76 are forced to be more aggressive as to not let the heavies build up. You seem to assume these heavy vehicles are inherently OP and need to be nerfed, i'm not sure this is the case. As well microed medium tanks while having more risk can be more effective at destroying armor and inflicting manpower bleed(on most maps) Though regardless of their impact i see that most games have been decided by the time the first tanks start rolling onto the field off so i don't really think it's just a late game heavy tank problem in 4v4s In: COH2 Balance |
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