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(2) Road to Narva

1 Aug 2016, 11:31 AM
#1
avatar of Spanky
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Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

(2)Road To Narva


Steam link : Road to Narva

Live feedback here!
3 Aug 2016, 12:42 PM
#2
avatar of Spanky
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Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

This map had an update, changed the resource points to _mp and should be balanced now.

Some cover balanced.
8 Aug 2016, 03:09 AM
#3
avatar of Tric
Master Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1330 | Subs: 3

After looking at the map in game here are the things that I would change/rework

  • Height variation is against the main combat lines, might not be a problem but will have to play test further to see if it is.
  • Pathing issues for tanks between buildings and groves and buildings to buildings in certain areas.
  • Middle VP does not accommodate for pathing on light vehicles and needs adjusted, since they currently path around far around it
  • Munitions being directly connected to base territory could be a problem, it can be disconnected easily but before the change is implemented I would like to see how it plays more and what advantages it truly gives, if any
  • Building imbalance favors west side base due to cutoff being held easier via team weapons, slight movement of the eastern side base will fix this.


That should be about it, if you have any questions let me know.
9 Aug 2016, 22:28 PM
#4
avatar of Spanky
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Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

Did an update on this map, buildings placed as you mentioned, pathing opened up and that's it for now, i wanna see some real gameplay on it before i go touch the height or munitions. Thanks for the review.
14 Aug 2016, 23:11 PM
#5
avatar of Decepticus

Posts: 140

Two Things I noticed:
  • Lack of buildings
    Other than the center, there is zero building in the north or south near most of the points to capture. Sneaky units like partisans, stormtroopers, commandos, jaegar infantry become useless, their commanders uninteresting. The lack of buildings in general reduces the strategic aspect of the game on this map.

  • Too much resources
    When the map is evenly divided, each player has 38 fuel and 58 munition. That's way too much. The fuel in particular means games on this map will be heavily tank-oriented. There won't be much early / infantry-based game at all. Also the huge difference between the +16 and +4 fuel territories means if you don't get the +16, it's pretty much game over. It shouldn't be more than twice the amount. I suggest you fix this by using a normal resource distribution (+7 instead of +16 fuel and maybe same for munition).
15 Aug 2016, 02:35 AM
#6
avatar of Tric
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Posts: 1330 | Subs: 3

Two Things I noticed:
  • Lack of buildings
    Other than the center, there is zero building in the north or south near most of the points to capture. Sneaky units like partisans, stormtroopers, commandos, jaegar infantry become useless, their commanders uninteresting. The lack of buildings in general reduces the strategic aspect of the game on this map.


  • Too much resources
    When the map is evenly divided, each player has 38 fuel and 58 munition. That's way too much. The fuel in particular means games on this map will be heavily tank-oriented. There won't be much early / infantry-based game at all. Also the huge difference between the +16 and +4 fuel territories means if you don't get the +16, it's pretty much game over. It shouldn't be more than twice the amount. I suggest you fix this by using a normal resource distribution (+7 instead of +16 fuel and maybe same for munition).



1.
This is fine and forces new playstyles which is what we are in need of, not cookie cutter more of the same. Just because there isn't a building in every portion of the map does not make it unbalanced or lacking in usefulness of playstyles, the buildings are full health and will be up for a long time due to them being cobblestone, so they will always have a purpose for the units you described due to being able to easily wrap behind engagements in the middle.

2.
This makes zero sense, this is true for 99% of maps in rotation, the resources are the standard recommended amount. 2 fuel, 2 munitions, 10 mp. By your logic every map will be heavily tank focused due to them all having the same access to resources as this.
15 Aug 2016, 02:50 AM
#7
avatar of Decepticus

Posts: 140

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2016, 02:35 AMTric


The resources are the standard recommended amount.


I'm not talking about the number of points. I'm talking about the amount of fuel (and munition) they provide. All 1v1 automatch maps (except Crossroads) provide a total of 52 fuel for both opponents to share. On this map it's 76. How is that standard?
15 Aug 2016, 10:26 AM
#8
avatar of Tric
Master Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1330 | Subs: 3



I'm not talking about the number of points. I'm talking about the amount of fuel (and munition) they provide. All 1v1 automatch maps (except Crossroads) provide a total of 52 fuel for both opponents to share. On this map it's 76. How is that standard?


Lets do a quick look of all the maps. They all feature 3 vps in addition to the other points.


  • Angoville
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 10

  • Arnhem Checkpoint
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 10

  • Crossroads
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 12

  • Faymonville Approach
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 10

  • Kholodny Ferma
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 10

  • La Gleize Breakout
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 8

  • Langreskaya
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 10

  • Lost Glider
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 8

  • Stalingrad
    • Munitions 2
    • Fuel 2
    • Territory 8



So lets do a quick look of what you are obviously pulling out of your ass.

You say this is not the standard, well according to the maps in rotation, which you sited, this is indeed the standard.

  • Total Maps with 12 Territory Points - 1
    • Crossroads

  • Total Maps with 10 Territory Points - 7
    • Angoville
    • Arnhem Checkpoint
    • Faymonville Approach
    • Kholodny Ferma & Kholodny Ferma Winter
    • Langreskaya & Langreskaya Winter

  • Total Maps with 8 Territory Points - 3
    • La Gleize Breakout
    • Lost Glider
    • Stalingrad



So I would like to ask you what maps are in your pool that I am not seeing? As Road to Narva features 10 territory 2 fuel, and 2 munitions and is clearly within the standard recommendation for the 1v1 map pool.
15 Aug 2016, 13:41 PM
#9
avatar of Decepticus

Posts: 140

Did you even read what you quoted from me? You are counting the NUMBER of territories. I am counting the AMOUNT of fuel those territories provide PER MINUTE. Typically the standard maps you mentioned have 2 +7 fuel and 10 +3 fuel strategic points, which add up to a total of 52 fuel per minute (7x2 + 10x3 + 4x2 for bases = 52 fuel). This map has 2 +16 fuel points and a bunch of +4 fuel strategic points which add up to 76 fuel per minute. 76 this map >>> 52 standard maps. DO YOU GET IT?

Maybe play a game on the map and then you'll see the numbers for yourself. In the meantime, avoid flaming language and get off your high horse.
15 Aug 2016, 15:03 PM
#10
avatar of beagletank

Posts: 37

@Tric: Decepticus is right. The current tactical map at the workshop isn´t correct. At the moment you earn +52 from both munition points and +16 for each fuel point.
15 Aug 2016, 19:51 PM
#11
avatar of Spanky
Senior Strategist Badge

Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

Guys, i've fixed it in the last update, you should check the updated picture again! fuel point gives +7 and munition point gives +11 and all the manpower points were turned into mp ones aswell.
15 Aug 2016, 19:57 PM
#12
avatar of beagletank

Posts: 37

Hi Spanky,

I have downloaded your map today and played it, but the high ressouce points are still there.
15 Aug 2016, 20:52 PM
#13
avatar of Spanky
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Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

weird, I'm more than sure I have updated it. :D Will have to check again.

Update: You guys were right, somehow my update didn't go thru but its fixed now, so thank you for reporting!
16 Aug 2016, 02:45 AM
#14
avatar of Tric
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Posts: 1330 | Subs: 3

It went through for me... please relic, fix publishing.
16 Aug 2016, 19:13 PM
#15
avatar of Spanky
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Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

:S well at least it's fixed now. Thank you!
24 Aug 2016, 15:25 PM
#16
avatar of Tric
Master Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1330 | Subs: 3

Feedback from stream

  • OOB area needs done
  • base areas have negative cover due to the roads, this can be very hard for certain factions to deal with
  • The East base on the northern road feels bland, I believe it is missing the shoulder splines that the rest of the map has, and it currently has no splats on it.


Some nitpicky stuff, but after this it should be a-OK.
24 Aug 2016, 19:57 PM
#17
avatar of Spanky
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Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

The last time you casted the game with me vs pred, i updated the roads and had some minor updates. But the thing is, with this laptop, i have everything on a minimum, so i can't really see the quality/fitting of the splats and splines ( a minus of working with low settings ).. :(
13 Sep 2016, 23:26 PM
#18
avatar of Spanky
Senior Strategist Badge

Posts: 1575 | Subs: 2

Final update has been done to the map as suggested in the message sent. Update going live tomorrow as Steam is currently down.

Thanks for this great competition!

Edit: Map is not updated!
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