Conscripts VS Volks?
2 Jan 2016, 19:19 PM
#101
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
Guys, your problem is that you actually use them. For team games - maxim spam forever +1 mortar and 1 zis into T70s and T34s.
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
2 Jan 2016, 19:55 PM
#102
Posts: 275 | Subs: 1
So if you dont run guards or shocks soviets dont have a decent frontline fighter? Notice how people dont even talk about penals...
Yep. Soviet doctrine have elite call infantry? It's good. Soviet doctrine don't have elite call infantry? This is bad doctrine. Same for tanks.
Victory needs no explanation, defeat allows none
2 Jan 2016, 20:00 PM
#103
Posts: 1891
Guys, your problem is that you actually use them. For team games - maxim spam forever +1 mortar and 1 zis into T70s and T34s.
1 con isn't bad as a capper and utility unit.
Also if you go Soviet Reserve Army rapid conscription negates mp bleed.
The Fascisti Will Pay.
3 Jan 2016, 05:22 AM
#104
Posts: 1063
1 con isn't bad as a capper and utility unit.
Also if you go Soviet Reserve Army rapid conscription negates mp bleed.
Using Rapid conscription means you bleed muni instead, some people make it work but for me, I prefer spending my muni on mines + demo and other abilities like incendiary arty, rapid conscription only give you 2 squad max, relief inf gives you 3.
3 Jan 2016, 06:12 AM
#105
Posts: 83
Cons are a close range unit. Cover doesn't apply in extremely close ranges anymore. There's also rng in this game so I could tell you the same story with Volks getting beaten by cons. Volks also cost 10 mp more.
The game is very balanced atm and any change runs a real risk to upset this.
You're horribly, horribly wrong. I suggest you load up the testing mod that lets you spawn units and test them. Maybe then you will realize that conscripts have almost literally no chance to beat volks. The only scenario where they can win, is if the first shot is fired at point blank range. This means that they have to somehow surprise the volk squad from behind a corner.
10 more manpower is collected in less than two seconds and saying that it justifies the efficiency gap is just hilariously stupid.
Sure, cons can win in the situation I described, but how often does that happen? Maybe once every few games.
3 Jan 2016, 15:44 PM
#107
Posts: 665
After testing it in games, a lot, yeah I've concluded that while conscripts have a use vs Ostheer, vs OKW you might as well not bother on many maps unless you get PPShs later on.
The only consistent scenario where conscripts have a chance against Volks is if they begin the battle at close range, and preferably if they are vet 3 (with Volks having vet 3 too, of course). Any other scenario, Volks walk all over them easily including with a shreck. And if you're in close range, guess what, you're also in grenade range, and forget about trading grenades because theirs is actually useful and isn't telegraphed years in advance.
In city maps, the match-up is somewhat even (but then Sturms fuck you up instead). In open maps, like Johnny said, forget it, give and just get Maxims. Your concripts are going to be cut down again and again if they can't surprise the enemy. Transition into Guards as soon as you can, at least these guys have a chance against the Ubervolks.
The only consistent scenario where conscripts have a chance against Volks is if they begin the battle at close range, and preferably if they are vet 3 (with Volks having vet 3 too, of course). Any other scenario, Volks walk all over them easily including with a shreck. And if you're in close range, guess what, you're also in grenade range, and forget about trading grenades because theirs is actually useful and isn't telegraphed years in advance.
In city maps, the match-up is somewhat even (but then Sturms fuck you up instead). In open maps, like Johnny said, forget it, give and just get Maxims. Your concripts are going to be cut down again and again if they can't surprise the enemy. Transition into Guards as soon as you can, at least these guys have a chance against the Ubervolks.
4 Jan 2016, 16:32 PM
#108
Posts: 1484
Cons should have non-doctrinal PPSH upgrade.
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4 Jan 2016, 16:54 PM
#109
Posts: 322
^ Yeah so they can easily beat Sturmpios and Pgrens.
Brummbar is very powerful
4 Jan 2016, 16:59 PM
#110
Posts: 1891
Cons can trade efficiently with Volks if your in cover and the Volks aren't. Kill 3 models, retreat, repeat.
I suppose cons sucking vs OKW is to compensate for how effective maxims, snipers, and guards are.
I suppose cons sucking vs OKW is to compensate for how effective maxims, snipers, and guards are.
The Fascisti Will Pay.
4 Jan 2016, 20:41 PM
#111
Posts: 1484
^ Yeah so they can easily beat Sturmpios and Pgrens.
Medium range PGs and Sturm wreck PPSH cons FYI.
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5 Jan 2016, 09:25 AM
#112
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
The next thread will be Maxim/Dushka VS MG-34, grab popcorn
5 Jan 2016, 09:36 AM
#113
Posts: 17889 | Subs: 8
Medium range PGs and Sturm wreck PPSH cons FYI.
PGs wreck them at any range on equal vet TBH, sturms need vet5 to do the same(assuming cons are vet3).
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
6 Jan 2016, 00:16 AM
#114
Posts: 160
After testing it in games, a lot, yeah I've concluded that while conscripts have a use vs Ostheer, vs OKW you might as well not bother on many maps unless you get PPShs later on.
The only consistent scenario where conscripts have a chance against Volks is if they begin the battle at close range, and preferably if they are vet 3 (with Volks having vet 3 too, of course). Any other scenario, Volks walk all over them easily including with a shreck. And if you're in close range, guess what, you're also in grenade range, and forget about trading grenades because theirs is actually useful and isn't telegraphed years in advance.
In city maps, the match-up is somewhat even (but then Sturms fuck you up instead). In open maps, like Johnny said, forget it, give and just get Maxims. Your concripts are going to be cut down again and again if they can't surprise the enemy. Transition into Guards as soon as you can, at least these guys have a chance against the Ubervolks.
Cons will win more than they lose if they are vet3 when volks are vet5 even when they walk up to them, you just gotta get to mid/close range for that to happen, which can be hard sometimes.
I think they should revert the 20% damage buff and instead just give volks a 20% increase in long range accuracy instead, that way they are still weak when mid/close range.
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