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Brits

1 Oct 2015, 17:00 PM
#1
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 830

Hi there,

Took some time off from Coh2 since the Brit launch. I disliked the Brit faction and its design and also disliked how useless USF was before, pretty much a bit tired of the game.

I have returned and my god not a lot of things have changed for the better now have they. I read some threads from time to time and had seen that Ostheer sniper play is pretty much the only way to defeat Brits, with which you can deny their late game overblown units. It seems pretty dead on to me. I can't win vs the brits without early sniper abuse.

Whatever I do, their infantry is too strong for my grenadiers or pioneers to handle once the tommies are in cover. Pgrens don't do much better in this respect. Aggressive mg42 placement will get punished since tommies in green cover or double flanking tommies will deal immense damage it seems.
I can get an early foothold but the Centaur arrives at like the 10-11 minute mark if rushed, at which point you need everything to have gone wonderful if you want to have a stug at the same time, otherwise it will rape you. This in combination with commandos that are dropping behind my pak40s and wiping them in a second, seems to me like the Brit faction still has a lot of units that are just plain overperforming (commandos, centaur) and a few units that are pretty much underperforming (their armored car for example)

So, how do you beat the brits on the shit Relic maps in a 1v1 without the sniper abuse? I can't seem to get it working. Any tactics, build orders and doctrinal choices would be very helpful.

Schwarzie
1 Oct 2015, 17:17 PM
#2
avatar of ThatRabidPotato

Posts: 218

Stay aggressive.

Successfully getting out a Centaur at the earliest possible point (around the ten-eleven minute mark) requires the Brit to have minimal manpower bleed, meaning no more than 3 infantry sections and no upgrades, and a lockdown hold on at least one fuel and a decent portion of the map.

Don't let him do that. Spread out, and challenge his capping power at all points of the map. Use riflenades to punish him for diving into green cover. Rifle nades and teller mines should be your main muni expenditures in the early mid game. Also, Flamer Pios and a mortar- he wants that green cover? Blast him out and burn him out.

I'm sorry to have to tell you this, but a sniper is absolutely necessary against Brits- if for no other reason than that any competent Brit player will have a sniper of their own and you'll have to countersnipe. 222 simply wastes fuel that could be going toward your Stug and Ostwind.
1 Oct 2015, 17:30 PM
#3
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1

Stay aggressive.

Successfully getting out a Centaur at the earliest possible point (around the ten-eleven minute mark) requires the Brit to have minimal manpower bleed, meaning no more than 3 infantry sections and no upgrades, and a lockdown hold on at least one fuel and a decent portion of the map.

Don't let him do that. Spread out, and challenge his capping power at all points of the map. Use riflenades to punish him for diving into green cover. Rifle nades and teller mines should be your main muni expenditures in the early mid game. Also, Flamer Pios and a mortar- he wants that green cover? Blast him out and burn him out.

I'm sorry to have to tell you this, but a sniper is absolutely necessary against Brits- if for no other reason than that any competent Brit player will have a sniper of their own and you'll have to countersnipe. 222 simply wastes fuel that could be going toward your Stug and Ostwind.


you dont get gren lmg? im doing pretty good against brits with mg-gren sniper as 3rd or 4th unit and then a gren again. dont lay mines, most british vehicles dont care to much about them, rifle nades are often a waste vs competent players too, animations needs alot of time and 90% of my rifle nades gets dodged. tech fast to t2 and get a 222, with the mapcontrol and man power drain he wont have something to counter the 222 for atleast 30-60sec, its the tiny window where u can cut him off. after that get a pak (or 2 if u think centaur is near) and get atleast 2 stugs, best paired with a ostwind. i dont bother to tech panthers because their dps and pen vs churchills are shit,2 stugs on the other hand take care 1 churchill.
1 Oct 2015, 17:36 PM
#4
avatar of Shanka

Posts: 323



you dont get gren lmg? im doing pretty good against brits with mg-gren sniper as 3rd or 4th unit and then a gren again. dont lay mines , most british vehicles dont care to much about them, rifle nades are often a waste vs competent players too, animations needs alot of time and 90% of my rifle nades gets dodged. tech fast to t2 and get a 222, with the mapcontrol and man power drain he wont have something to counter the 222 for atleast 30-60sec, its the tiny window where u can cut him off. after that get a pak (or 2 if u think centaur is near) and get atleast 2 stugs, best paired with a ostwind. i dont bother to tech panthers because their dps and pen vs churchills are shit,2 stugs on the other hand take care 1 churchill.


I'm not ok with the don't lay mines, you should always lay mines >:(

Anyways great BO to counter brits :)
1 Oct 2015, 17:40 PM
#5
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post1 Oct 2015, 17:36 PMShanka


I'm not ok with the don't lay mines, you should always lay mines >:(

Anyways great BO to counter brits :)

im rally a great fan of mines, but tbh i find myself having trouble upgrading all my 3 grens with lmg (its a must buy vs british inf, really), using 1-2 rifle nade in early game and then have some spare munitions for mines.only when im having excellent mapcontrol i will spam mines. and again mines are VERY VERY VERY risky against british, because they often just hover it. check it out, reported many times from many persons and saw and raged about it myself
1 Oct 2015, 17:52 PM
#6
avatar of ThatRabidPotato

Posts: 218


im rally a great fan of mines, but tbh i find myself having trouble upgrading all my 3 grens with lmg (its a must buy vs british inf, really), using 1-2 rifle nade in early game and then have some spare munitions for mines.only when im having excellent mapcontrol i will spam mines. and again mines are VERY VERY VERY risky against british, because they often just hover it. check it out, reported many times from many persons and saw and raged about it myself
I've heard about that bug too, but never seen it personally. My tellers always seem to do their job if detonated. Invaluable for slowing down a Centaur.

Riflenades are epic against Brits in cover. Seriously. Just make sure to fire them off during large engagements where the Brit player probably won't notice the one Grenadier kneeling amidst the larger chaos, and try to have a flanking squad or squad on the periphery shoot them. Also, try aiming at a piece of cover before the Brit troops actually reach it to cut down on the time he has to dodge.
1 Oct 2015, 17:54 PM
#7
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 16589 | Subs: 8

Use osttruppen for unlimited amount of autowins unless you fight top 50 players.
1 Oct 2015, 17:59 PM
#8
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1

I've heard about that bug too, but never seen it personally. My tellers always seem to do their job if detonated. Invaluable for slowing down a Centaur.

Riflenades are epic against Brits in cover. Seriously. Just make sure to fire them off during large engagements where the Brit player probably won't notice the one Grenadier kneeling amidst the larger chaos, and try to have a flanking squad or squad on the periphery shoot them. Also, try aiming at a piece of cover before the Brit troops actually reach it to cut down on the time he has to dodge.


im sorry but there are no large fights in the first 9mins or so. yes shooting in the path or at the cover can work, but honestly most players did see that coming because they knew i wont fire a grenade at them when they are running towards a cover. it still can win fights because the cover gets nullified for some seconds. and yes there are 3 possibilitys i saw: 1. mine will detonate but no crit 2. mine will just sit there looking at the bottom of the tank 3. mine do its job. centaur seems to have the most hover power(but maybe its just subjective because centaurs are in every game)

Use osttruppen for unlimited amount of autowins unless you fight top 50 players.

care to tell me the tactics? never used osttruppen. u just outcap him or what?
1 Oct 2015, 18:04 PM
#9
avatar of ThatRabidPotato

Posts: 218



im sorry but there are no large fights in the first 9mins or so. yes shooting in the path or at the cover can work, but honestly most players did see that coming because they knew i wont fire a grenade at them when they are running towards a cover. it still can win fights because the cover gets nullified for some seconds. and yes there are 3 possibilitys i saw: 1. mine will detonate but no crit 2. mine will just sit there looking at the bottom of the tank 3. mine do its job. centaur seems to have the most hover power(but maybe its just subjective because centaurs are in every game)


care to tell me the tactics? never used osttruppen. u just outcap him or what?
Of course there are large engagements. 3 Grenadiers plus an MG vs 2 or 3 Tommies and MG is 7 or 8 units engaged at one time. That can happen by the 5 minute mark easily. Add in snipers, engineers, mortars, and whatever else is produced from Tier 2 structures and you have yourself a full scale fight.

If you're not forcing engagements at every opportunity, you're already doing something wrong against Brits.
1 Oct 2015, 18:09 PM
#10
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 7766 | Subs: 2

I'll skip MG early on (as your first units), as you want to be aggresive with the sniper with your gren/pios backing up. Preference and map.

I'll say 222 is fine as long as you're aggressive with it by denying any counter harassment and pushing/harrasing Tommies.

It's really important to account for number of units and map presence. You should know by the number of IS/MG/RE/UC when a sniper might show up and when to expect the Centaur.
1 Oct 2015, 18:16 PM
#11
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 16589 | Subs: 8


care to tell me the tactics? never used osttruppen. u just outcap him or what?

You pretty much do what you'd do with grens, except you get them on field faster and in bigger number, get HMG42 and go for cutoff camp, fast T2 into HT and thats basically it, rarely games last longer.
1 Oct 2015, 18:24 PM
#12
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1593 | Subs: 1


You pretty much do what you'd do with grens, except you get them on field faster and in bigger number, get HMG42 and go for cutoff camp, fast T2 into HT and thats basically it, rarely games last longer.

ty will try that out if i got the commander!

I'll skip MG early on (as your first units), as you want to be aggresive with the sniper with your gren/pios backing up. Preference and map.

I'll say 222 is fine as long as you're aggressive with it by denying any counter harassment and pushing/harrasing Tommies.

It's really important to account for number of units and map presence. You should know by the number of IS/MG/RE/UC when a sniper might show up and when to expect the Centaur.

222 is all about the timing, if it comes to late its 99% useless. i like the mg start personally, u can go very aggressive with it and its a nice safe zone for ur sniper to work. check out the finals, i think there was always a mg in the buildorder vs brits. buts its personal prefence surely


1 Oct 2015, 18:28 PM
#13
avatar of NigelBallsworth

Posts: 172

There is such a wealth of threads right now about how Brits are so OP. While I agree that some aspects of this faction are a LITTLE over the top, my advice would be : suck it up. How long have Allied players had to deal with ridiculous Axis units or abilities ? So now Axis no longer have easy trollolol wins, and the fanboys are getting all bent out of shape because they have to use combined arms and tactics.

DISCLAIMER: I'm talking about 3v3, 4v4.
1 Oct 2015, 18:55 PM
#14
avatar of gary.giles71

Posts: 165

If you are DevM ... Brits are a piece of cake. Watch his last match in the OCF.
1 Oct 2015, 18:58 PM
#15
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 830

There is such a wealth of threads right now about how Brits are so OP. While I agree that some aspects of this faction are a LITTLE over the top, my advice would be : suck it up. How long have Allied players had to deal with ridiculous Axis units or abilities ? So now Axis no longer have easy trollolol wins, and the fanboys are getting all bent out of shape because they have to use combined arms and tactics.

DISCLAIMER: I'm talking about 3v3, 4v4.


I explicitly asked for 1v1 advice. Never did I state I find the brits OP, just overperforming in some aspects and underperforming in others.

Go and put your 3v3 and 4v4 drama somewhere else please.
1 Oct 2015, 18:59 PM
#16
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 830


You pretty much do what you'd do with grens, except you get them on field faster and in bigger number, get HMG42 and go for cutoff camp, fast T2 into HT and thats basically it, rarely games last longer.


Will try this, thank you.

Edit: don't have the 0cp Osttruppen doctine, sure as hell aint paying 4,99 for a commander. So just have to make due with normal Ostheer.
1 Oct 2015, 19:02 PM
#17
avatar of BlackKorp

Posts: 964 | Subs: 2

brits are just op as hell, they really need a serious view on it and balancing. Losing against scrubs pisses me off :guyokay:
1 Oct 2015, 19:03 PM
#18
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 830



you dont get gren lmg? im doing pretty good against brits with mg-gren sniper as 3rd or 4th unit and then a gren again. dont lay mines, most british vehicles dont care to much about them, rifle nades are often a waste vs competent players too, animations needs alot of time and 90% of my rifle nades gets dodged. tech fast to t2 and get a 222, with the mapcontrol and man power drain he wont have something to counter the 222 for atleast 30-60sec, its the tiny window where u can cut him off. after that get a pak (or 2 if u think centaur is near) and get atleast 2 stugs, best paired with a ostwind. i dont bother to tech panthers because their dps and pen vs churchills are shit,2 stugs on the other hand take care 1 churchill.


Will try this thank you!

jump backJump back to quoted post1 Oct 2015, 17:36 PMShanka


I'm not ok with the don't lay mines, you should always lay mines >:(

Anyways great BO to counter brits :)


You can lay mines all you want, the Brit tanks seem to ignore them 90% of the time, especially the cromwell and Centaur fore some reason.

I'll skip MG early on (as your first units), as you want to be aggresive with the sniper with your gren/pios backing up. Preference and map.

I'll say 222 is fine as long as you're aggressive with it by denying any counter harassment and pushing/harrasing Tommies.

It's really important to account for number of units and map presence. You should know by the number of IS/MG/RE/UC when a sniper might show up and when to expect the Centaur.


Well I expect a Centaur in every game now, they always come at the 10-12 minute mark, 10-11 if rushed, 11-12 if not rushed at all.

Still playing against Brits almost requires sniper, which is dull.

1 Oct 2015, 20:14 PM
#19
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 830

Just had another game vs a Brit player by the name of Jove.

I had the south side of langres, he rushed a tommie squad into the house near the south vp, and nothing I could do about it. Went to the left to cap with my pios whilst my double grens bypassed the garrison to cap the fuel, which I couldn't connect since he was camping the cut off of said fuel. Got a mortar, only way to dislodge him, but that meant one less squad capping around. Pios came across another tommie squad and got pushed off

He then got a vickers, camped it on the right fuel and the left fuel was guarded by tommies capping close by. He then got a sniper and I admitted my defeat and gave up. it was 6:55 and I knew the centaur would arrive in 5 minutes, which he acknowledged.

How on earth do you beat this? I just can't figure it out..
They are to potent in such situations early game.
1 Oct 2015, 20:15 PM
#20
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 16589 | Subs: 8

Just had another game vs a Brit player by the name of Jove.


Rank 3 brit player.
Nuff said.
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