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russian armor

Some balance proposals

30 Sep 2015, 11:36 AM
#1
avatar of Muxsus

Posts: 170

Had some free time for a wall of text, enjoy. (I'm a bit biased towards Allies, forgive me glorious alex)
Sov:
Conscript vet3 bonus from 40% to 33% (bfff was overkill)
Penal SVT dps profile mirrored from M1 Garands; cost increase to 300; stock weapons are now Guard Mosins; 3 SVTs can be bought for 50 munitions (medium range stock specialist infantry; they will probably be useful enough to get T1)
Sov sniper recloak time increased to 6 sec; model health increased to 82, rec accuracy increased to 1.5; (in line with other snipers; no longer wiped by mortars, more hp to compensate for mediocre ROF)
ZiS-2 Barrage replaces tracking as vet ability; cost reduced to 30 muni (tracking was useless and barrage cost too high)
Su-76 Penetration reduced to 160/150/140; barrage replaces tracking as vet ability; costs 20 muni now; cooldown halved (was op vs heavies and arguably mediums)
T-34-76 Main gun accuracy vs infantry increased - dunno how to do that; coaxial MG dps increased by 1.5; ram now always causes crew shock on both sides and destroys main gun on t34 without immobilizing; fuel cost increased to 95 (is now an AI support/flanking tank, meant to be a component of combined arms);
T-34-85 Penetration increased by 20; everything else above is also true except from fuel cost (needed a buff);
Su-85 Penetration increased to 240/230/220; reload increased by 1 second; vet2 ROF bonus removed, +20% pen instead; accuracy increased to 0.06 short, 0.04 far (dedicated stock soft counter to heavy tanks, not meant to murder mediums);
ISU-152 AP round now has 0.5 deflection damage (historically correct; also ISU needed to be more potent against heavies);
IL-2 Loiter Cost decrease to 150 munitions; no longer prioritizes vehicles;
IL-2 Strafe Line width doubled; disabled whatever caused it to be random at hitting anything; IL-2 Bombing Run damage per bomb decreased to 240; cost to 160;
Tripwire flares construction time and cost halved;
DSHK dps bug fixed; dps at all ranges increased by 1.2;
Ost:
Panzer 4 Penetration increased by 20
Ostwind Damage increased to 30; attack is now accuracy-based instead of scatter-based, making it less good against cover and retreating troops (in-line with centaur);
Brummbar Range increased by 10; projectile speed doubled; scatter slightly decreased (needed buff)
Tiger Ace Now costs 900 MP and 230 FU. Resource penalties removed. TWP is back with a massive cooldown (90 seconds?).
G43 upgrade now replaces all 4 weapons of a squad; dps is Kar98k-like curve with substantially more dps at all ranges. Applies for both grens and pgrens;
Incendiary AP rounds (MG42) cost 20 muni;
Okw:
Volksgrenadier grenade is now 25 munitions;
Deploying okw truck small arms resistance increased a bit;
ISG Rate of fire reduced by 1.5; damage against structures and garrisoned troops increased by 1.5; now gives a special type of suppression that won't get prolonged by being exposed to fire, similarly to a stun grenade;
Flak HT front and rear armor improved;
Flak Truck penetration reduced;
FU penalty reworked: start with 1.0 income; getting an armored vehicle multiplies current income by 0.85 (will lift on vehicle death) to buff both early game Luchs and Flak HT starts and to incentivise vehicle preservation.
Obers cost decreased to 380 (reinforce cost accordingly)
JP4 cannot cloak when seen by the enemy;
Usf:
Rifles vet3 buff from 20% to 15%;
Major artillery and fake artillery cost halved;
Pack howitzer change identical to that of the ISG;
Easy 8 cost increased by 5 FU;
Brits:
Universal Carrier Vickers K burst length increased significantly;
Mills Bombs throw range increased to 25; cost increased to 30;
Royal Engineers cost increased to 220;
AEC Armored Car range increased by 10; acceleration increased;
Centaur doesn't instakill troops in buildings; cooldown between bursts increased by 1.5;
Firefly cooldown reduced by 2; tulip rockets now cost 100 to install and firing them is free; tulip rockets damage halved.
Forward Assembly armor increased to 35; forward retreat point upgrade cost reduced to 100 MP;
17pdr health increased by 200;
Brace is now a toggle ability with a 45 second cooldown between toggles;
25pdr artillery AOE increased; number of shells for infantry section ability down to 4 per howie;
Churchill Crocodile main gun ROF halved;
Anti-building flame mortar support changed to target infantry squads;
Commandos Light gammon bomb timer increased to 2.0 sec (airlaning officer bomb timer to 1.5); Commandos cost increased to 400 (glider insertion cost unchanged);
Hammer Gammon bombs cost to 50 (in line with satchel);
Comet fuel cost reduced by 10;
Heavy engineers armor reduced to 1.5; movement penalty removed; upgrade costs 75 manpower;

Constructive feedback is appreciated.




30 Sep 2015, 11:58 AM
#2
avatar of InSaNiedi

Posts: 43

Well actually sounds pretty nice but i personally would improve some points:

Removing the Tiger Ace penalty completely would make it far too strong (no one would ever egt a normal Tiger again if you just pay a bit more MP to get Vet 3 one) - I would set an MP drain about 100 for about 5 to 10 min (like Kingtiger in Coh1) after this time the penalty should be removed;

Tulpics: Meh not sure what to do with them i like your idea but i would increase the costs to about 150 OR set the recharge timer to 2 or 3 minutes than i am fine with them;

Churchills: Well I hate playing against these monsters but also i am using them myself so I gotta say 640 HP for the croc is nothing - my suggestion: 1200HP for the normal churchill and the AVRE (still 400 HP less than now) and 1000 HP for the croc (also 400 less than now)

otherwise great post i would agree with the other ideas.

30 Sep 2015, 13:11 PM
#3
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17892 | Subs: 8

I like the brummbar range increase suggestion.

Rest of the changes are either overbuffs, overnerfs or just don't make sense at all.
30 Sep 2015, 13:47 PM
#5
avatar of WhySooSerious

Posts: 1248

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Sep 2015, 13:11 PMKatitof
I like the brummbar range increase suggestion.

Rest of the changes are either overbuffs, overnerfs or just don't make sense at all.


Funny enough I actually agree with Katitof but I would agree in a more professional way. :P I don't think the SU-85 needs a offensive buff and a compensation for it by taking away its vet 2 but just a mobility buff. Penal buff suggestion is nice though :D Oh god that su-76 nerf suggestion though thats going to bring it back to when it was useless. I think the Su-76 should keep its penetration now since the SU-85 heavily outshines it in the late game unless the SU-76 is kept until vetted which will make it ok in the late game. P4 performs its role very well so I don't think it needs a buff. The Churchill nerf and T3476 change is pretty nice though.
30 Sep 2015, 14:14 PM
#6
avatar of Bad_Vader

Posts: 88 | Subs: 1

I agree with Katitof a lot of these changes are unnecessary. The Churchill nerfs especially, holy sh*t that hp would make them useless.

The changes I can get behind are the Brumbar and con.

30 Sep 2015, 15:07 PM
#7
avatar of Imagelessbean

Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1

I stopped reading when I saw that you wanted to increase armor on deploying OKW trucks. Why should an overly aggressive OKW player be allowed to construct his building in combat? Once it is set up it is invulnerable to small arms which is a huge advantage early game.

IL-2 bombs decreased in damage? Why? At same time no change to stuka dive bomb!

Brumbar range change is fine.
30 Sep 2015, 15:37 PM
#8
avatar of hannibalbarcajr

Posts: 503

A lot of good suggestions. Only one that is way off base is halving the health of the Churchill and its variants. Your Volks mp blob cost doesn't need fuel or tech just some
Munitions. That Being said the crocodile needs its flame damage reduced a bit and probably range. I could agree to bringing health down to ~1250 ish but not more than that
30 Sep 2015, 15:49 PM
#9
avatar of velmarg

Posts: 37

Penal buff to near-Rifleman effectiveness on top of a reduction in the buff to Cons would just basically lead to no one building Cons anymore. I'm in favor of giving SOME kind of buff to Penals, though. Honestly, between the molotovs on Cons and the flamethrower on Combat Engies, Penals having flamethrowers just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Maybe giving them an AT weapon upgrade instead? Besides the AT nade upgrade on Cons, Soviets have no non-doctrinal anti-armor infantry.

Then again, that'd probably make it way to easy to spam snipers and counter a 222 with your Penals. Hrm.

Maybe replace Con PPSH upgrades in commanders with a DP machine gun and give Penals a stock upgrade to three PPSHs?

I don't know, I need more coffee
30 Sep 2015, 16:00 PM
#10
avatar of Iron Emperor

Posts: 1653

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Sep 2015, 13:11 PMKatitof
I like the brummbar range increase suggestion.

Rest of the changes are either overbuffs, overnerfs or just don't make sense at all.


I also have to agree with Katitof. And 2nd of all ehy ostheer pz4 increase 20+ pen and not the OKW version?
30 Sep 2015, 18:30 PM
#11
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

Put some format into that wall of text. Too many ideas thrown around.
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