When will people finally get it?
I'll repeat it for all you "hurr durr If you wanna nurf x then you'll have to nurf y too bcuse it's way mor overpovrd".
Stuff that wipes Squads without warning and no possibility to react is just bad fuckintg design, no matter what faction.
Example Katusha/Stuka; loud as, distinctiv howling sound when firing, random spacing of rockets within target sector, still short time window to react once the first rocket landed.
As long as cooldown, cost, and aoe damage are in line, those units are fine.
M8a1/M8 Greyhound CANISTERSHOT; no distinctive warning, moving your units or even retreating them does not prevent a wipe.
This is bad design because it completely nullifies the skill to keep squads alive.
@Budwise; The Problem lies with the way it's ballistic arc is designed afaik. Shooting with flat trajectory, for whatever reason, leads to very frequent squad wipes. The LeIG and the Pack howie share the same mechanic, yet they wipe squad less often because their less mobile and thus don't fire with flat trajectory as often as the M8a1 does.
Howitzer Tank Overperforming
31 Dec 2014, 08:37 AM
#21
Posts: 747
31 Dec 2014, 09:02 AM
#22
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Scott is OP? So fragile unit.. So easy to avoid... So useless against vehicles...
Luchs is a WAY better than scott at killing infantry.
Scott is great against not-movig targets.
Somethimes it can hit moving target but its because of scatter.
US Forces have nothing more to deal with end-game ultimate Axis infantry.
Luchs is a WAY better than scott at killing infantry.
Scott is great against not-movig targets.
Somethimes it can hit moving target but its because of scatter.
US Forces have nothing more to deal with end-game ultimate Axis infantry.
31 Dec 2014, 09:08 AM
#23
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
Scott is OP? So fragile unit.. So easy to avoid... So useless against vehicles...I'd say both the M8A1 and the luchs are op. One has acuurate squad wipe cannon, the other hass a rapid firing cannon of doom. I'd say the M8A1 is better against vehicles than the Luchs unless you're talking about light vehicles then I would retract my statement.
Luchs is a WAY better than scott at killing infantry.
Scott is great against not-movig targets.
Somethimes it can hit moving target but its because of scatter.
US Forces have nothing more to deal with end-game ultimate Axis infantry.
_____________________________________________________________________________
31 Dec 2014, 09:11 AM
#24
Posts: 2053
EVERYTHING'S OP THESE DAYS
IT EITHER ONE SHOTS OR IS IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL AND CUTS DOWN THE ENEMY IN SECONDS
Except SU-76m and 251 flame turd. They were smudged into inexistence because reasons.
Also the other stuff that you never ever see.
IT EITHER ONE SHOTS OR IS IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL AND CUTS DOWN THE ENEMY IN SECONDS
Except SU-76m and 251 flame turd. They were smudged into inexistence because reasons.
Also the other stuff that you never ever see.
31 Dec 2014, 09:17 AM
#25
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
EVERYTHING'S OP THESE DAYS250 half track OP.
IT EITHER ONE SHOTS OR IS IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL AND CUTS DOWN THE ENEMY IN SECONDS
Except SU-76m and 251 flame turd. They were smudged into inexistence because reasons.
Also the other stuff that you never ever see.
_____________________________________________________________________________
31 Dec 2014, 09:19 AM
#26
Posts: 198
When will people finally get it?
@Budwise; The Problem lies with the way it's ballistic arc is designed afaik. Shooting with flat trajectory, for whatever reason, leads to very frequent squad wipes. The LeIG and the Pack howie share the same mechanic, yet they wipe squad less often because their less mobile and thus don't fire with flat trajectory as often as the M8a1 does.
Haven't they changed the trajectory to always be "arced" a few patches ago? It's mentioned in this changelog.
31 Dec 2014, 09:20 AM
#27
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
I'd say both the M8A1 and the luchs are op. One has acuurate squad wipe cannon, the other hass a rapid firing cannon of doom. I'd say the M8A1 is better against vehicles than the Luchs unless you're talking about light vehicles then I would retract my statement.
Well, I saw replays where Luchs was chasing damaged KV-8 and killed it
If not supported, Luchs can kill everything without turret or with slow turret rotation.
Don't forget that Scott can be killed with single shot by Jadgtiger or Elephant
31 Dec 2014, 09:21 AM
#28
Posts: 107
So all the P4s, Tigers, King Tigers, IS2s, Shermans that also wipe squads are fine except the one unit you blame losing. Indeed "helarious".
31 Dec 2014, 09:25 AM
#29
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
RNG king.
Well, I saw replays where Luchs was chasing damaged KV-8 and killed it
Can't be helped here. Why don't they actually swapped the health of both P2 and M8 and then we can tone down the M8.
Don't forget that Scott can be killed with single shot by Jadgtiger or Elephant
_____________________________________________________________________________
31 Dec 2014, 09:30 AM
#30
Posts: 747
Haven't they changed the trajectory to always be "arced" a few patches ago? It's mentioned in this changelog.
Yes they have, but it still fires either in a flat or steep arc. The change you mentioned was more to make them less effective vs. vehicles afaik (Scott vs. Puma Problematic).
31 Dec 2014, 10:36 AM
#31
Posts: 542
I am surprised complaints didn't come earlier to be honest. It seems to be extremely precise even against moving targets. The results you earn with this in comparison to stuff like Ostwinds or other light tanks that cannot just stand far outside of range seems pretty competitive.
On other hand it is not cheap for basically a mobile mortar... so you would expect some good results out of it.
Maybe lower accuracy / AoE, but in combination with a cost reduction? Or maybe just lower velocity, so it is not as accurate against moving targets. I mean, look how slow the projectiles of a Brummbär are in comparison...
On other hand it is not cheap for basically a mobile mortar... so you would expect some good results out of it.
Maybe lower accuracy / AoE, but in combination with a cost reduction? Or maybe just lower velocity, so it is not as accurate against moving targets. I mean, look how slow the projectiles of a Brummbär are in comparison...
31 Dec 2014, 12:17 PM
#32
Posts: 3600 | Subs: 1
I had one just an hour ago, in 20 minutes firing and barraging a lot it only reached Vet1. This unit is clearly RNG dependent (like so many others).
I had it missing so many time its targets. It left unarmed a Mg42 squad for 5 minutes, keep missing it all the time.
I had it missing so many time its targets. It left unarmed a Mg42 squad for 5 minutes, keep missing it all the time.
31 Dec 2014, 13:00 PM
#33
Posts: 655
Permanently BannedThe perceived over-performance from this vehicle is a result of the cover system/units bunching/poor inf pathing. Many units are preforming stronger than they have in previous patches without having been changed at all, or at least in a way that wouldn't directly effect it's combat effectiveness. This unit's rate of fire combined with the way indirect fire/AOE weapons work now is what makes it so strong.
I think that needs to be changed, not simply just nerfing this unit.
I think that needs to be changed, not simply just nerfing this unit.
A Fallen Scrub
31 Dec 2014, 13:47 PM
#34
Posts: 862
When will people finally get it?
This is bad design because it completely nullifies the skill to keep squads alive.
I see. So you also are arguing for the removal of vet4 and vet5.
31 Dec 2014, 13:51 PM
#35
Posts: 249
Tbh people who are saying this thing is not overperforming are using them wrong probably. Just ignore the barrage and use it with direct fire and it wipes squads in cover quite regularly. The shell also flies so fast you can barely dodge it.
ps. I'm gonna assume that's the game I played vs you.
ps. I'm gonna assume that's the game I played vs you.
31 Dec 2014, 15:54 PM
#36
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
I had one just an hour ago, in 20 minutes firing and barraging a lot it only reached Vet1. This unit is clearly RNG dependent (like so many others).
I had it missing so many time its targets. It left unarmed a Mg42 squad for 5 minutes, keep missing it all the time.
Do not use the barrage. Just use direct fire.
The big difference with other light vehicles is that you don't know what to expect when you are facing it. When you fight a T70 or Luch you can calculate the risk of fighting or not and negate it's effectiveness by using cover.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
31 Dec 2014, 17:17 PM
#37
Posts: 1468 | Subs: 4
M8 Scott has been OP for a long time. I think the only unit that squad wiped more than this was the old ISU... maybe the 120mm mortar.
Long range, fast rate of fire, great AoE profile, highly mobile, highly accurate... yeah it's pretty crazy strong.
Needs some combination of: range nerf (probably not), rate of fire nerf (yes please), and slight AoE profile adjustment. Simply way too good at wiping infantry right now.
In general I wish more tanks were like the Ostwind - what I mean by that is that the Ostwind's damage is predictable because it is consistent. You can actually react to an Ostwind driving up to one of your squads, unless you're already super low HP. You can generally predict how much damage it is going to do, and in the right hands it bleeds a lot without just wiping infantry with impunity.]
(Too bad Ost T3 is still trashcan tier compared to Tigers and other call-ins)
Long range, fast rate of fire, great AoE profile, highly mobile, highly accurate... yeah it's pretty crazy strong.
Needs some combination of: range nerf (probably not), rate of fire nerf (yes please), and slight AoE profile adjustment. Simply way too good at wiping infantry right now.
In general I wish more tanks were like the Ostwind - what I mean by that is that the Ostwind's damage is predictable because it is consistent. You can actually react to an Ostwind driving up to one of your squads, unless you're already super low HP. You can generally predict how much damage it is going to do, and in the right hands it bleeds a lot without just wiping infantry with impunity.]
(Too bad Ost T3 is still trashcan tier compared to Tigers and other call-ins)
31 Dec 2014, 17:34 PM
#38
Posts: 747
I see. So you also are arguing for the removal of vet4 and vet5.
Absoulutely. Or at least change it so vet 4 and 5 only give abililties like flare, smoke, sprint etc. but no stat buffs.
31 Dec 2014, 17:46 PM
#40
14 
Posts: 10665 | Subs: 9
M8 Scott has been OP for a long time. I think the only unit that squad wiped more than this was the old ISU... maybe the 120mm mortar.
Long range, fast rate of fire, great AoE profile, highly mobile, highly accurate... yeah it's pretty crazy strong.
Needs some combination of: range nerf (probably not), rate of fire nerf (yes please), and slight AoE profile adjustment. Simply way too good at wiping infantry right now.
In general I wish more tanks were like the Ostwind - what I mean by that is that the Ostwind's damage is predictable because it is consistent. You can actually react to an Ostwind driving up to one of your squads, unless you're already super low HP. You can generally predict how much damage it is going to do, and in the right hands it bleeds a lot without just wiping infantry with impunity.]
(Too bad Ost T3 is still trashcan tier compared to Tigers and other call-ins)
Each man to his own, I guess
I preface this reply, by stating clearly that I am not a Strategist
I have never seen anything approaching the Ostwind for USF, apart from the AA-Halftrack.
I honestly find it difficult to compare the Scott to the old ISU. IMO, the Scott is a highly effective unit, used correctly, too often ignored by USF players (at a lower level).
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