USF have so many ways to kill it... Mortars, AT gun without resigning from MH and AT mines, cheap pack howie.
And it's not easy even for Soviets.
I saw a game Paula vs Jesulin (I guess) on Kholodny.
Very good etc but that's not the point.
The point is, once Schwerer was built, there was not chance for Jesulin to take cut off.
Once or twice he manage to get fuel but it;s only because Schwerer vision was blocked by trees.
He was not able to kill it, he was not able to cut off, while he did not have anything to prevent his cut off like OKW can.
No place to shoot with AT gun, and mortaring takes ages.
And you want to tell me, that Schwerer is not a problem?
Schwerer so broken, will it be fixed in the upcoming patch?
14 Mar 2015, 12:45 PM
#21
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
14 Mar 2015, 13:05 PM
#22
Posts: 87
120mm etc
so you have to play only soviets and only specific commanders to deal with a f*cking base building ?
14 Mar 2015, 13:08 PM
#23
Posts: 471
It shouldn't be able to solo a tank, but apart from that it's absolutely fine.
14 Mar 2015, 13:10 PM
#24
Posts: 627
It made sense when OKW had to lock down sectors to get the proper income, and had to have a supply chain. Defending those base sectors was vital.
This has not been true for a -long- time, and the thing is an utter pain to remove if it's the second thing an OKW player spends fuel on.
Especially given that attack ground with an AT gun is alarmingly inaccurate into the FoW, and any move that spots the flack HQ for shooting at requires a sniper or a vehicle, or an infantry unit that will immediately get shot to all hell and suppressed to boot.
Yes, there are ways to deal with it. But why the hell are people being made to deal with it to begin with? OKW are not short on manpower, and not even short on munitions, nor early game strength. What purpose does a free teching into huge area denial serve for modern OKW other than to annoy the nips off USF players, who don't even have a non doctrinal mortar?
Never mind that an upgraded & Vetted sturmpio squad can repair it faster than an AT gun can damage it.
This has not been true for a -long- time, and the thing is an utter pain to remove if it's the second thing an OKW player spends fuel on.
Especially given that attack ground with an AT gun is alarmingly inaccurate into the FoW, and any move that spots the flack HQ for shooting at requires a sniper or a vehicle, or an infantry unit that will immediately get shot to all hell and suppressed to boot.
Yes, there are ways to deal with it. But why the hell are people being made to deal with it to begin with? OKW are not short on manpower, and not even short on munitions, nor early game strength. What purpose does a free teching into huge area denial serve for modern OKW other than to annoy the nips off USF players, who don't even have a non doctrinal mortar?
Never mind that an upgraded & Vetted sturmpio squad can repair it faster than an AT gun can damage it.
14 Mar 2015, 13:15 PM
#25
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Never mind that an upgraded & Vetted sturmpio squad can repair it faster than an AT gun can damage it.
14 Mar 2015, 14:05 PM
#26
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
It made sense when OKW had to lock down sectors to get the proper income, and had to have a supply chain. Defending those base sectors was vital.
This has not been true for a -long- time, and the thing is an utter pain to remove if it's the second thing an OKW player spends fuel on.
Especially given that attack ground with an AT gun is alarmingly inaccurate into the FoW, and any move that spots the flack HQ for shooting at requires a sniper or a vehicle, or an infantry unit that will immediately get shot to all hell and suppressed to boot.
Yes, there are ways to deal with it. But why the hell are people being made to deal with it to begin with? OKW are not short on manpower, and not even short on munitions, nor early game strength. What purpose does a free teching into huge area denial serve for modern OKW other than to annoy the nips off USF players, who don't even have a non doctrinal mortar?
Never mind that an upgraded & Vetted sturmpio squad can repair it faster than an AT gun can damage it.
The Schwer is neither free, and nor is OKW's early game strength all that good.
Until you get your Schwer done your stuck with Sturms, a unit whose dps is crap unless your up a units ass, and Volks which preform worse than cons till they hit vet 3. The Schwer is vital because it A. gives you access to your only blob counters if you went T1, and B. It gives you your only mobile heavy AT if you went T2!
The problem with the Schwer currently is that it does to much DPS to mediums, if it didn't damage mediums at all it would be perfectly fine.
The people who hate it seem pissed they can't roam the map with a giant blob of rifleman annihilating anything and everything while capping points far faster due USF's much better early to mid game map presence.
So what if it locks down a point? I can do the same thing with USF with FP spam far far earlier in the game.
14 Mar 2015, 14:20 PM
#27
Posts: 1484
Schwerer should need a muni upgrade for the gun, I should be able to harass my opponents fuel as he does MINE. OKW needs a over haul or there is no such thing as E-Sport for this game.
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14 Mar 2015, 14:22 PM
#28
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
The Schwer is neither free, and nor is OKW's early game strength all that good.
Until you get your Schwer done your stuck with Sturms, a unit whose dps is crap unless your up a units ass, and Volks which preform worse than cons till they hit vet 3. The Schwer is vital because it A. gives you access to your only blob counters if you went T1, and B. It gives you your only mobile heavy AT if you went T2!
The problem with the Schwer currently is that it does to much DPS to mediums, if it didn't damage mediums at all it would be perfectly fine.
The people who hate it seem pissed they can't roam the map with a giant blob of rifleman annihilating anything and everything while capping points far faster due USF's much better early to mid game map presence.
So what if it locks down a point? I can do the same thing with USF with FP spam far far earlier in the game.
Are you serious, really?
Fusi, Jagers, Falls, MGs...
No one is pissed because of rifle blob. It's all about sending 1-2 units to cap, not blobbing to cap other side. It's bacis rule in CoH2. Cap points, multitasking, fight on one side, cap the other.
Do you see difference between BP and Schwerer? I can just go around arc of fire and kill it with few sec with 1 volks squad.
14 Mar 2015, 14:27 PM
#29
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Are you serious, really?
Fusi, Jagers, Falls, MGs...
No one is pissed because of rifle blob. It's all about sending 1-2 units to cap, not blobbing to cap other side. It's bacis rule in CoH2. Cap points, multitasking, fight on one side, cap the other.
Do you see difference between BP and Schwerer? I can just go around arc of fire and kill it with few sec with 1 volks squad.
Do you even know how FP spam works? You have multiple FP's covering each other so they opponent can't get around you. There are multiple maps were you can put 2 FP's down and prevent any sort of push until they opponent has AT guns.
And Fusi and Jaegars ain't blob counters. Both have worse DPS than rifles and only modestly better DPS than cons. Fallsch are fragile as shit and very, very expensive.
lol the MG34 a blob counter, jesus christ man.
Nobody pissed about rifle blob? Have you ever played Ostheer versus a rifle spammer?
14 Mar 2015, 14:39 PM
#30
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Do you even know how FP spam works? You have multiple FP's covering each other so they opponent can't get around you. There are multiple maps were you can put 2 FP's down and prevent any sort of push until they opponent has AT guns.
And Fusi and Jaegars ain't blob counters. Both have worse DPS than rifles and only modestly better DPS than cons. Fallsch are fragile as shit and very, very expensive.
lol the MG34 a blob counter, jesus christ man.
Nobody pissed about rifle blob? Have you ever played Ostheer versus a rifle spammer?
Yes, briliant! Im going to spam FP so I wont have any infantry! Then my enemy gets Puma and all FP are gone.
Yes, MG34 is amazing since OKW is floating with MP.
Getting 2 of them and stick close to each other can cause problems.
Countless high level 1v1 games where MGs were deadly.
And again, stop saying anything about game mechanic. You were wrong so many many times... Fusi have better DPS than Rifles from 20 to 35 range and almost equal at 15. Rifles are better only 0-15.
14 Mar 2015, 14:47 PM
#31
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Yes, briliant! Im going to spam FP so I wont have any infantry! Then my enemy gets Puma and all FP are gone.
Yes, MG34 is amazing since OKW is floating with MP.
Getting 2 of them and stick close to each other can cause problems.
Countless high level 1v1 games where MGs were deadly.
And again, stop saying anything about game mechanic. You were wrong so many many times... Fusi have better DPS than Rifles from 20 to 35 range and almost equal at 15. Rifles are better only 0-15.
Sing it with me now! Nobody fights at long range, no body fights at long range, nooooo bodddyyyy sitssss and fighttttts a long RANGE!
And FP spam a drain? Lmao dude early game your infantry is going to be owning him so hard getting a lot of FP's down really isn't an issue.
The MG34 is fine if you have several overlapping, but with the MG42 not being able to handle blobs you think a unit that's like it but WORSE in every way is going to fucking handle blobs?
Dude stop digging yourself a bigger hole, you seriously cannot stop yourself from bitching about every single unit OKW has, I'm surprised you haven't started a thread complaining about how OP elite armored is~
14 Mar 2015, 14:54 PM
#32
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Sing it with me now! Nobody fights at long range, no body fights at long range, nooooo bodddyyyy sitssss and fighttttts a long RANGE!
And FP spam a drain? Lmao dude early game your infantry is going to be owning him so hard getting a lot of FP's down really isn't an issue.
The MG34 is fine if you have several overlapping, but with the MG42 not being able to handle blobs you think a unit that's like it but WORSE in every way is going to fucking handle blobs?
Dude stop digging yourself a bigger hole, you seriously cannot stop yourself from bitching about every single unit OKW has, I'm surprised you haven't started a thread complaining about how OP elite armored is~
Nobody fights at long range?
This sentence just killed me.
If anyone is digging a hole, it's you
I started thread about Jadgtiger when it was shooting through everything as OP unit.
I started thread about Luchs as OP unit since it has wipe everything and has 400 HP when compare to Stuart or T70.
I started thread about Jaeger, cause I wanted to know something about sniping ability - no OP.
I agree with Obers OP.
I agree with Schwerer OP.
Now, show me thread, post where Im saying that: SP, MG34, Falls, Jaeger, Panther, ST, KT, Jadpanzer, leig, Puma etc are OP. Guess what, you won't find it because opposite to you, Im not blinded fanboy and when something allied is OP I admit it but there we have problem. Axis units are better in almost everything. Allies dont have superior tank, infantry, etc. Only howitzers or I should say howitzer - B4 - which I agree should not kill KT in 1 shot when FMR used.
Im going to stop there. Won't feed a troll.
14 Mar 2015, 14:59 PM
#33
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
Nobody fights at long range?
This sentence just killed me.
If anyone is digging a hole, it's you
I started thread about Jadgtiger when it was shooting through everything as OP unit.
I started thread about Luchs as OP unit since it has wipe everything and has 400 HP when compare to Stuart or T70.
I started thread about Jaeger, cause I wanted to know something about sniping ability - no OP.
I agree with Obers OP.
I agree with Schwerer OP.
Now, show me thread, post where Im saying that: SP, MG34, Falls, Jaeger, Panther, ST, KT, Jadpanzer, leig, Puma etc are OP. Guess what, you won't find it because opposite to you, Im not blinded fanboy and when something allied is OP I admit it but there we have problem. Axis units are better in almost everything. Allies dont have superior tank, infantry, etc. Only howitzers or I should say howitzer - B4 - which I agree should not kill KT in 1 shot when FMR used.
Im going to stop there. Won't feed a troll.
You just spent 3 pages of the JLI thread calling them units you don't need to micro that shouldn't come behind the lines, your thread was just a stealth call for nerfs thread, nothing more nothing less.
And yes nobody will fight at long range given the choice because if I'm an allied player I am never going to fight at long range because it's suicide. If I can do an insane amount of DPS up close why in gods name would I just plink at him from long range?
The only time long range DPS matters is on stupidly open maps with no cover like Steppes, the rest of them it's trivial because the units will be so close to each other thanks to the small size of the map, lack of open areas, and littering of cover.
Your continued instance that all allies units are worse when that has literally never been true is just annoying.
14 Mar 2015, 15:03 PM
#34
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
You just spent 3 pages of the JLI thread calling them units you don't need to micro that shouldn't come behind the lines, your thread was just a stealth call for nerfs thread, nothing more nothing less.
And yes nobody will fight at long range given the choice because if I'm an allied player I am never going to fight at long range because it's suicide. If I can do an insane amount of DPS up close why in gods name would I just plink at him from long range?
The only time long range DPS matters is on stupidly open maps with no cover like Steppes, the rest of them it's trivial because the units will be so close to each other thanks to the small size of the map, lack of open areas, and littering of cover.
Your continued instance that all allies units are worse when that has literally never been true is just annoying.
You won't find "nerf" word it that thread.
Thread was about Jaeger utility.
Thread was very clean and helpful to understand Jaeger until you came in.
End of story.
Ok, next time I will use my Rifles and Paras with 1919 at close range. Thanks for tip.
Allied units are not worse... 120mm, B4, ISU, Sniper. I guess the only units that Axis don't have something bigger and better to response.
End.
14 Mar 2015, 15:12 PM
#35
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
You won't find "nerf" word it that thread.
Thread was about Jaeger utility.
Thread was very clean and helpful to understand Jaeger until you came in.
End of story.
Ok, next time I will use my Rifles and Paras with 1919 at close range. Thanks for tip.
Allied units are not worse... 120mm, B4, ISU, Sniper. I guess the only units that Axis don't have something bigger and better to response.
End.
LMG's are obviously for better DPS at mid to long range, but getting in close to units like Grens/Fuss/Volks to do a shitload of DPS to them and wipe them because you do a lot more with BARS/PPsH/Garands/Mosin in close range is just how the game works.
Unless I have LMG's I'm not going to sit out at long range, it's the reason whys Obers are so bloody OP is because they have this free LMG that does stupid amounts of DPS at long range.
The IS2 is better than the Tiger, T34/85 better than the Panzer IV, ZiS only has 10 less pen than Pak40 but can also kill inf, Cons beat Volks, Riflemen beat Volks/Fuss/JLI/Grens, Para's beat every Axis unit except Obers. 82mm mortar has a better Vet ability, Katyusha is far better than the Pwerf.
Could go on all day dude, stop buying into the Krupp steel meme and harden up.
14 Mar 2015, 15:56 PM
#36
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
.
The IS2 is better than the Tiger, T34/85 better than the Panzer IV, ZiS only has 10 less pen than Pak40 but can also kill inf, Cons beat Volks, Riflemen beat Volks/Fuss/JLI/Grens, Para's beat every Axis unit except Obers. 82mm mortar has a better Vet ability, Katyusha is far better than the Pwerf.
And KT is better than IS2, Panther is better than T34/85, ZiS is worse than Pak, Cons/Rifles/Paras/Shocks... All are melted by Obers, OSt mortart is better than Soviets, and Stuka is better than Katy.
At the end of chain there is always Axis unit. Except 120, B4 and ISU.
14 Mar 2015, 16:02 PM
#37
Posts: 471
At the end of chain there is always Axis unit. Except 120, B4 and ISU.
Actually, B4 and ISU are both hard countered by the Elephant doctrine with recon, stuka bomb and Elephant too
14 Mar 2015, 16:05 PM
#38
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Actually, B4 and ISU are both hard countered by the Elephant doctrine with recon, stuka bomb and Elephant too
That's right but the point is different
The point is about allies having best assault gun and best howitzer.
They are easily countered but that's a different matter
14 Mar 2015, 16:07 PM
#39
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
And KT is better than IS2, Panther is better than T34/85, ZiS is worse than Pak, Cons/Rifles/Paras/Shocks... All are melted by Obers, OSt mortart is better than Soviets, and Stuka is better than Katy.
At the end of chain there is always Axis unit. Except 120, B4 and ISU.
Wow, things that cost MORE are better than things that cost less? Jesus christ this is the revelation of the century!
A Panther which costs 40 fuel more is better? A KT, the most expensive tank in the game, is better than a tank you don't need to tech for? Obers which cost 400 MP are better than units that DON'T take teching and cost lower amounts of MP? Say it ain't so!
The Stuka which costs 15 fuel more in a fuel starved faction is better than the Kat? Jeeze man some intense wisdom being laid down in this thread.
And lol the Ost mortar being better, I would sacrifice my cat to give Ostheer mortars precision strike.
I like how you cannot understand unit costs, like at all.
14 Mar 2015, 16:13 PM
#40
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Wow, things that cost MORE are better than things that cost less? Jesus christ this is the revelation of the century!
A Panther which costs 40 fuel more is better? A KT, the most expensive tank in the game, is better than a tank you don't need to tech for? Obers which cost 400 MP are better than units that DON'T take teching and cost lower amounts of MP? Say it ain't so!
The Stuka which costs 15 fuel more in a fuel starved faction is better than the Kat? Jeeze man some intense wisdom being laid down in this thread.
And lol the Ost mortar being better, I would sacrifice my cat to give Ostheer mortars precision strike.
I like how you cannot understand unit costs, like at all.
This is not about costs... Garden me... This is about Axis having best units in the end.
Why we have KT? Let's remove KT and leave OKW with single Tiger so IS2 will be best one.
And since you don't play 1v1, cost does not matter because in team games KT can hit the field 14-18min.
Why we don't have more expensive and way better infantry, tanks and other stuff for Allies?
This is not about costs it has nothing to do with it.
All axis units outpefrorm allied ones in 1v1 engagement of those units.
That's why you don't see many thread about OPnes of Allies, because Axis have everything better.
How did you even figure out cost while it has nothing to do with thing we are talking about.
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