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Relic, please adjust Vet gain on the Stuka zu Fuss.

15 Nov 2014, 07:53 AM
#41
avatar of ☭ Калашникова ☭

Posts: 322

Hmm, Stuka definitely needs some vet changes, but if we move the incendiary strike to vet 1/2, I fell it may be OP. It may just be RNG for me, but I feel like the stuka fire barrage does a shitload more damage when it hits than an offmap incendiary strike.


That's because it dose, Well not exactly but let me explain-
Imagine a Olympic ring, Soviet's incend barrage has roughly that pattern (Please note that this ability is extremely random in placement at times) Three patches of fire drop, Little overlap.

Now you got the Stuka, 6 rockets on a tightly packed area with lots of overlapping fire...

MOAR DOTS!!!
15 Nov 2014, 08:30 AM
#42
avatar of $nuffy

Posts: 129

totally agree.. never, ever unlocked napalm barrage on stuka in automatch, and I even use Stuka countdown reduction bulletin.. like it isn't even there.
15 Nov 2014, 17:46 PM
#43
avatar of Sierra

Posts: 432

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Nov 2014, 08:30 AM$nuffy
totally agree.. never, ever unlocked napalm barrage on stuka in automatch, and I even use Stuka countdown reduction bulletin.. like it isn't even there.


Just my point, thank you for speaking up about it!
16 Nov 2014, 01:49 AM
#44
avatar of Sierra

Posts: 432

*Bump

For more support please!
16 Nov 2014, 13:52 PM
#45
avatar of TomOfAction
Benefactor 341

Posts: 84

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Nov 2014, 10:30 AMSierra
For most team weapons and artillery pieces, their alternate fire modes are locked by Vet-1 and don't always cost so much in munitions. But this is not the case with the Stuka zu Fuss, instead it's alternate fire mode of Incendiary Rocket Barrage is locked behind a Vet-4 rank that it may never see in an entire game, and still costs a whopping 100 munitions, which is already difficult enough to achieve for a hard pressed OKW player. (Think lots of grenades and panzershreks and mines)


I think that for the alternate fire mode to be justifiably locked behind Vet-4, that it should be a bit more accessible and attainable than it is currently.


Furthermore I daresay that it opens up far more options for the OKW player to eliminate blobs of Allied infantry and artillery/ATG's as well as garrisoned units, which currently they are sorely lacking.

So please take this into consideration as currently I would go as far as to assume that most OKW players don't even know that there is an Incendiary Barrage option due to how exceedingly rare it is that the Stuka zu Fuss would ever reach Vet-2 or Vet-3, let alone Vet-4.


I actually think that you might be on to something. Perhaps, make the alternate veterancy four barrage (Incendiary Rockets) cost 30 - 60 munitions, have it unlocked at Veteran Tier Two, and make the individual utilizing the unit have to choose between which barrage they would like to execute (regardless of which one they select, the other has to cool-down as if it were used as well). I agree that the odds of ever getting a vet four "Walking Stuka" in a 1v1/2v2 is very slim, but I can't say whether or not it still holds true to 3v3/4v4, since I rarely play as Axis in those.
16 Nov 2014, 14:00 PM
#46
avatar of TomOfAction
Benefactor 341

Posts: 84

Can we fix panzerwerfer first?


Although the Panzerwerfer can (arguably) be considered the Ostheer/Wehrmacht equivalent of the "Walking Stuka" (in terms of selecting an artillery piece), the roles that each one fulfills (respectively) greatly vary. The Oberkommando West's "Walking Stuka" is more-or-less designed to hard-counter garrisoned units in buildings, static positions (mounted team weapons and immobile artillery pieces), and to a lesser extent blobs – while as the Panzerwerfer for the Wehrmacht is designed to directly provide a hard-counter Allied blobbing of units. Just because the Panzerwerfer isn't as "spot on" in wrecking enemy units, doesn't mean it is "less-efficient" (in lack of a better phrase) as a unit. It simply just means that they are designated to perform different tasks when a player utilizes them in combat.
16 Nov 2014, 14:07 PM
#47
avatar of ☭ Калашникова ☭

Posts: 322



Although the Panzerwerfer can (arguably) be considered the Ostheer/Wehrmacht equivalent of the "Walking Stuka" (in terms of selecting an artillery piece), the roles that each one fulfills (respectively) greatly vary. The Oberkommando West's "Walking Stuka" is more-or-less designed to hard-counter garrisoned units in buildings, static positions (mounted team weapons and immobile artillery pieces), and to a lesser extent blobs – while as the Panzerwerfer for the Wehrmacht is designed to directly provide a hard-counter Allied blobbing of units. Just because the Panzerwerfer isn't as "spot on" in wrecking enemy units, doesn't mean it is "less-efficient" (in lack of a better phrase) as a unit. It simply just means that they are designated to perform different tasks when a player utilizes them in combat.


I totally agree, However when the Panzerwerfer is compared to its direct counterpart (The kat truck) it is painfully obvious that the kat truck is simply just better at its job.

Kat truck can fire and hit units that hit T as soon as they hear the sound and catch units.
While the Panzerwerfer can fire on a immobile blob and kill 3 models. If it was a kat truck it would wipe most of those units.

Stuka is what panzerwefer wishes it can be when it grows up.

(Please note that I don't want the Panzerwefer to be better then Kat, those two units need to be equal is all)
16 Nov 2014, 14:19 PM
#48
avatar of TomOfAction
Benefactor 341

Posts: 84



I totally agree, However when the Panzerwerfer is compared to its direct counterpart (The kat truck) it is painfully obvious that the kat truck is simply just better at its job.

Kat truck can fire and hit units that hit T as soon as they hear the sound and catch units.
While the Panzerwerfer can fire on a immobile blob and kill 3 models. If it was a kat truck it would wipe most of those units.

Stuka is what panzerwefer wishes it can be when it grows up.

(Please note that I don't want the Panzerwefer to be better then Kat, those two units need to be equal is all)


Perhaps, they increase the accuracy modifier on the Panzerwerfer to scale with the Katyusha? I don't know how that would physically work, but I think it might increase the usage of the Panzerwerfer and upgrading to Battle Phase Three, in general.

Also, I agree with the fact that the Katyusha, even through all its previous nerfs/tweaks, still is a lot more potent then the Panzerwerfer. Perhaps, if we bring the Panzerwerfer back down to the Battle Phase Two building again, and allow the individual playing as the Wehrmacht to access it a bit earlier then the Soviet player, this could give an incentive to the Wehrmacht players to actually utilize it more frequently. I'm sure that there would be other issues that would arise with this, such as finding a replacement for the Panzerwerfer in the Battle Phase Three building, and also balancing the said artillery piece, so it isn't overwhelming and impossible to counter.
16 Nov 2014, 14:25 PM
#49
avatar of ☭ Калашникова ☭

Posts: 322



Perhaps, they increase the accuracy modifier on the Panzerwerfer to scale with the Katyusha? I don't know how that would physically work, but I think it might increase the usage of the Panzerwerfer and upgrading to Battle Phase Three, in general.

Also, I agree with the fact that the Katyusha, even through all its previous nerfs/tweaks, still is a lot more potent then the Panzerwerfer. Perhaps, if we bring the Panzerwerfer back down to the Battle Phase Two building again, and allow the individual playing as the Wehrmacht to access it a bit earlier then the Soviet player, this could give an incentive to the Wehrmacht players to actually utilize it more frequently. I'm sure that there would be other issues that would arise with this, such as finding a replacement for the Panzerwerfer in the Battle Phase Three building, and also balancing the said artillery piece, so it isn't overwhelming and impossible to counter.


What happened is Panzerwefer used to do 160 damage now it dose 80 in addition to firing half the total rockets.
17 Nov 2014, 12:10 PM
#50
avatar of $nuffy

Posts: 129



..but I can't say whether or not it still holds true to 3v3/4v4, since I rarely play as Axis in those.


Believe me, it Holds very true !
17 Nov 2014, 13:22 PM
#51
avatar of Cadoc

Posts: 62

I'm all for this, as long as it comes at the same time as significant nerfs to the Stuka.
17 Nov 2014, 23:19 PM
#52
avatar of Sierra

Posts: 432

jump backJump back to quoted post17 Nov 2014, 13:22 PMCadoc
I'm all for this, as long as it comes at the same time as significant nerfs to the Stuka.


Comments like this convince me that people aren't interested in balance and only really interested in punishing other factions for some self serving and misguided idea of "justice" where there is none to be had.
18 Nov 2014, 00:31 AM
#53
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned
ONly thing stuka needs... is a nurf to hp and AOE
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