russian armor

Assault Greandier Swarm effectiveness against Americans

17 Jul 2014, 14:05 PM
avatar of broodwarjc

Posts: 798

I am starting this thread to discuss the effectiveness of Assault Grenadier spam versus American Rifle Spam. I am an OKW player and lately I have been playing with Ostheer players who like to use the Mechanized Assault Doctrine on 3v3 games. Ostheer players then proceed to build 4 Assault Grenadiers and run them at enemy blobs, sacrificing defense and point fortification. I don't know if the problem is the players or this strategy, but the Assault Grenadiers have been getting destroyed by the Amer. Riflemen. This then leads to weak flanks and points being lost. Even those who can somewhat use this unit effectively get annihilated by early vehicles. As the OKW I try to send support attacks to flank the enemy, but I can't hold all the points on the map myself. Please Ostheer players stop using the Assault Grenadier spam or can someone post some effective uses/tips and tricks for this unit. Because I have had multiple loses recently, and one win, with Ostheer allies who use this against 2 or 3 American enemies.
17 Jul 2014, 14:32 PM
avatar of KovuTalli

Posts: 332

This probably would of worked before they increased lethality, how it's really hard to assault in to certain positions if there is no cover between you and your opponents units, especially if they are already in cover.

Mostly an issue early game vs Rifles as they tend to drop 1 model in the first volley or two.
17 Jul 2014, 18:30 PM
avatar of sickpetey

Posts: 101

Yeah I tried using assaults thinking they would manage to overwhelm riflemen but they would usually lose a model or two before even coming close enough.

I think its better to use assault grenadiers as flankers and ambushers or with use of smoke for cover. Using them in blobs would be a waste since their grenade only comes in T2 and unlike grenadiers they have no panzerfaust.
18 Jul 2014, 02:11 AM
avatar of TheMightyCthulu

Posts: 127

They are basically just regular Grenadiers with SMGs. Use them to flank, and have regular long-range Grens and an MG42 or two to back them up. My build order is AG, G, MG42, AG, G.
18 Jul 2014, 02:19 AM
avatar of ilGetUSomDay

Posts: 612

Only buy one or two of them as suppliments to your army. They are not effective in a hoard as you pointed out for various reasons
18 Jul 2014, 03:48 AM
avatar of van Voort
Honorary Member Badge

Posts: 3518 | Subs: 2

Depends what you are doing with them and on the map.

I have been as Axis where Kubels and AGrens totally pushed the US off the map in the first 5 minutes.

AGrens give Axis early field presence that they otherwise won't get, especially when your only other option for that is Ostruppen
18 Jul 2014, 04:15 AM
avatar of FestiveLongJohns
Patrion 15

Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2

One thing to keep in mind when using assault grens is that they are very expensive to reinforce. They are not meant to be a mainline infantry unit. I would never build more than 1. The key to using them it to use their sprint ability to put yourself in good situations. With this ability you can close distance very quickly and use it tactically to either force a squad out of cover, or retreat at the risk of taking heavy losses. The rest of the commander is great against americans though.

The stug E shreds rifles, and can handle the AA halftrack easily. On top of that you get a reliable off map arty strike, and the fearsome tiger. Its a strong commander overall, you just have to avoid spamming assault grens.
18 Jul 2014, 05:11 AM
avatar of coh2player

Posts: 1571


I don't have much experience playing ost vs US (yet, but eventually I will), but the 2 times I did with AG spam worked really well. The whole doctrine in fact puts a lot of pressure on USA. I had 4 of them.

Depends what you are doing with them and on the map.

I have been as Axis where Kubels and AGrens totally pushed the US off the map in the first 5 minutes.

AGrens give Axis early field presence that they otherwise won't get, especially when your only other option for that is Ostruppen
18 Jul 2014, 19:29 PM
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 1225

Assgrens are nice on constrained maps to win a crucial first or second engagement, however they dont scale. Minor dosage best dosage.
18 Jul 2014, 20:09 PM
avatar of broodwarjc

Posts: 798

Yep just lost another match due to allies who both were using assault grenadiers on the steepes, a wide open map where the grenadiers got chewed up before they even got close. Also they built 2-3 of them and only 1 mg and no mortars. We got pushed back to our starting area within the first 5 minutes. This is another problem with the "Trial" commanders is that people want to test them and have no idea how to effectively use them and end up collapsing the whole team.
28 Jul 2014, 00:42 AM
avatar of Kjarmik

Posts: 36

This doctrine is my personal favourite. I usually get two AG squads before I get one or two HMG squads, depending on my opponent. The AG gives an awesome field presence in the beginning, and using sprint frequently is crusial for success. One thing to note is that their grenade spam is quite potent, and shouldn't be neglected. It costs 40 mun, but a well-placed grenade spam have often wiped entire USF rifle squads for me.
Yes, they are squishy. Yes they are expencive. Yes, they are useless even at medium range. These are things your enemy know about, so they will engage them primarely in med to long range most of the time. send them in the best cover available while you pull up an HMG squad to suppress them, and move in to complete the job.

The rest of the commander, as said earlier by coh2player, quite excellent against USF. One can ofcourse use the commander and ignore the AG completely if one so desires.
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