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September Balance Patch preview [SPBP] - general discussion

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15 Aug 2019, 13:37 PM
#81
avatar of LooniestRumble

Posts: 36

Now that the OST bunker is un scope is a good chance to fix the bug where all units garrisoned die if the bunker is destroyed.

Besides that, the IS2 should not get 55 range at vet 2, because it allows it to counter its own counters. A better reload or something else would be better to reinforce its roles as a close range brawler and infantry/fortifications killer.

Jackson nerfs area not the right approach, it would only make shermans more uncommon, making HVAP a toggleable with high pen but low acc and rate of fire, and normal ammo having less pen but more rof and acc, as has been suggested, would make it a flexible unit capable of being the only TD usf has without being a jack of all trades, master of everyrhing.

15 Aug 2019, 13:38 PM
#82
avatar of Jilet

Posts: 344

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 13:22 PMKatitof

Are tommies good without upgrades?


They are damn good.
15 Aug 2019, 13:41 PM
#83
avatar of Balanced_Gamer

Posts: 783

DO tommy cost 340 mp and 120 fu at least to unlock ?


Very true indeed. Their timing is still pretty much similar as they used to be. Maybe the upgrade should come when they become available.

Since the player would have to take the risk of going directly for the base (to get the Obers accessible) meaning leaving it defenseless (the base) and skip the opportunity of purchasing vehicles.

The MG should be available anyway. Locking it is pretty bad I would say. No point really in going straight for it I think


jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 13:22 PMKatitof

Are tommies good without upgrades?

Obers are stronger.


Only slightly but when Tommies upgrade to bolster 5 man which is when they acquire it early.

5 man Tommies easily defeats Obers without MG.
15 Aug 2019, 13:43 PM
#84
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 1962 | Subs: 3

Besides that, the IS2 should not get 55 range at vet 2, because it allows it to counter its own counters.


The IS-2 has 40 range, the vet increases it to 50.
15 Aug 2019, 13:48 PM
#85
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 3970

Fair and balanced , like the osther 60 range TD and the 60 range tiger at vet 3
15 Aug 2019, 13:50 PM
#86
avatar of capiqua
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 974 | Subs: 2

-Opel Blitz/HT healing. It is unnecessary. Adding this strategy, others are removed, I don't think this change is successful.
-Jackson, Churchil. Last heavy tanks added in the last patch, boosting the axis, it should not be
necessary nef the allies. More nerf tanks allies, no please.
-ArtyFlares okw is a full abuse 4v, combined with artillery. I guess it's a part of the frustration that has to stay in coh. Guys you have to take it off.
-REAL cooldown heavytanks. Should be implemented to all heavy tanks; when it is destroyed, start the cooldown of call-in (120minutes seconds or maybe more). In 4v it is very easy to replace a heavy one. That's because a REAL time penalty is necessary.
-JPIV's cost does not reflect its actual performance, compared to a su85:



edited: minutes by seconds
15 Aug 2019, 13:52 PM
#87
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 3970

120 minutes CD ? So I have to wait 2 games ?
15 Aug 2019, 14:19 PM
#88
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 1962 | Subs: 3

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 13:50 PMcapiqua
-REAL cooldown heavytanks. Should be implemented to all heavy tanks; when it is destroyed, start the cooldown of call-in (120minutes seconds or maybe more). In 4v it is very easy to replace a heavy one. That's because a REAL time penalty is necessary.

Would've loved to do this, but sadly this isn't possible.


jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 13:50 PMcapiqua
-JPIV's cost does not reflect its actual performance, compared to a su85:

How so? The Jagdpanzer IV has really bad penetration that does not scale with vet, limiting its use to countering mediums and TDs and having mediocre DPS against anything bigger (unless you're constantly spamming HEAT shells). I think the cost is fair, they just have different strengths.
15 Aug 2019, 14:24 PM
#89
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 3970

I think he is saying that jp4 cost too much
15 Aug 2019, 14:30 PM
#90
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 12:21 PMLago


I think you're oversimplifying the Command Panther problem a bit, but I get the sentiment.

I personally think it should be a 60/60 fuel split, and the JPIV should be in the first half.

That gives Battlegroup builds decently fast access to a solid anti-tank vehicle, solves the long standing JPIV/Panther redundancy problem, and gives OKW players who lose their SPHQ a second comeback option instead of just the King Tiger.


I love this idea!
15 Aug 2019, 14:42 PM
#91
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066



No one is forcing players to build their SPHQ on the front line though. If you like producing tanks, then put it somewhere safe or somewhere you're certain you can defend it. There's no need to continue to give OKW a free map denial tool without a big risk attached to it. And OKW still has the now improved King Tiger if they lose the SPHQ, anyway.


Isn't this the point of the entire building? Why on earth would you not build tanks? You need it for doctrinal units now too lol. Are you even reading your own statements?

Yeah KT, that is the answer to Schwere issues.
15 Aug 2019, 15:09 PM
#92
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 1962 | Subs: 3

Isn't this the point of the entire building? Why on earth would you not build tanks? You need it for doctrinal units now too lol. Are you even reading your own statements?


You seem to completely miss the point. The SPHQ's primary role is indeed producing tanks, so why should OKW get bailed out with a cheap replacement if they put it on the frontline carelessly and lose it? No one is forcing players to do that, OKW doesn't need to do that to survive, it's just an option. If you want to produce tanks, and if you want to be able to produce tanks throughout the match, put it somewhere safe. A free big area denial tool should not come without substantial risks. Enemies should be rewarded for succesfully assaulting and killing it.
15 Aug 2019, 15:32 PM
#93
avatar of Sully

Posts: 318 | Subs: 2


How so? The Jagdpanzer IV has really bad penetration that does not scale with vet, limiting its use to countering mediums and TDs and having mediocre DPS against anything bigger (unless you're constantly spamming HEAT shells). I think the cost is fair, they just have different strengths.


Why does the JP4 cost more than an SU-85 if it's a worse tank destroyer? Can't self spot, can't reliably penetrate heavy armor like all allied TDs can, and still feels like it almost always misses when it has to rotate to a target (bug?). Its cost only makes a little sense with the old, broken, vet bonuses. Even with HEAT rounds it struggles to penetrate an IS2 in my experience.
15 Aug 2019, 15:34 PM
#94
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 1679

Sander stop spreading misinformation. SwererHQ is not a free area denial tool. It has costs, for the sws and the upgrade. Those costs included the actual flak gun. 120 Fu to enable mediums and heavy tanks is too pricey compared to any other faction
15 Aug 2019, 15:39 PM
#95
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 2609 | Subs: 1

Sander stop spreading misinformation. SwererHQ is not a free area denial tool. It has costs, for the sws and the upgrade. Those costs included the actual flak gun. 120 Fu to enable mediums and heavy tanks is too pricey compared to any other faction


Major say Hi.

Now I'll quote you every time someone tells me that Lieutenant or Captain are free unit given with tier tech.
15 Aug 2019, 15:41 PM
#96
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 911



You seem to completely miss the point. The SPHQ's primary role is indeed producing tanks, so why should OKW get bailed out with a cheap replacement if they put it on the frontline carelessly and lose it? No one is forcing players to do that, OKW doesn't need to do that to survive, it's just an option. If you want to produce tanks, and if you want to be able to produce tanks throughout the match, put it somewhere safe. A free big area denial tool should not come without substantial risks. Enemies should be rewarded for succesfully assaulting and killing it.


Does USA loose their t4 if their Major/lft/cptn dies?

Furthermore there arnt many safe locations vs Priests and fixed howitzers.

Furthermore if we set a cost to the value that the 37mm flak provides, roughly less than that of a bofors, thats the cost that should be lost if t3 is lost.
15 Aug 2019, 15:45 PM
#97
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 1679

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 15:39 PMEsxile


Major say Hi.



Because swerer can me moved around, used as a toggleable rendezvous point, call in arty and if you loose it you can keep training more tanks...

SwererHQ and major, they both are just identical /s

Watch out boys, 3 free squads on USF are as good as 1 free 'bofors' for OKM. Again the balance falls short on the USF side.

Quote me as much as you want, it will remind you how wrong you were
15 Aug 2019, 15:49 PM
#98
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 2609 | Subs: 1



Does USA loose their t4 if their Major/lft/cptn dies?

Furthermore there arnt many safe locations vs Priests and fixed howitzers.





Because swerer can me moved around, used as a toggleable rendezvous point, call in infantry and if you loose it you cant train more tanks...

SwererHQ and major, they both are just identical /s

Watch out boys, 3 free squads on USF are as good as 1 free 'bofors' for OKM. Again the balance falls short on the USF side.

Quote me as much as you want, it will remind you how wrong you were


You like saying non sens both of you, do you? USF tier 3 is a building and if you take it down, guess what, you can't build anymore units from it.
What you're comparing is if by some mechanism it would be possible to destroy swerer's canon and need to pay manpower to rebuild it on top of the T3.

15 Aug 2019, 15:50 PM
#99
avatar of Farlon

Posts: 182

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 15:49 PMEsxile




You like saying non sens both of you, do you? USF tier 3 is a building and if you take it down, guess what, you can't build anymore units from it.
What you're comparing is if by some mechanism it would be possible to destroy swerer's canon and need to pay manpower to rebuild it on top of the T3.


You can repair the USF buildings though
15 Aug 2019, 15:51 PM
#100
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 1679

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 15:49 PMEsxile




You like saying non sens both of you, do you? USF tier 3 is a building and if you take it down, guess what, you can't build anymore units from it.
What you're comparing is if by some mechanism it would be possible to destroy swerer's canon and need to pay manpower to rebuild it on top of the T3.


If the tech is bounded to the buildings, then the tech squads come for free. You are welcome
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