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September Balance Patch preview [SPBP] - general discussion

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15 Aug 2019, 07:08 AM
#62
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2153

New OKW officer is useless and a joke compared to other officers:
- Arty Officer
- NKVD officer
- Airlanding Officer
15 Aug 2019, 07:47 AM
#64
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3085 | Subs: 7

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 01:42 AMmrgame2
Heavy crush to comet..not sure how 4 man ost can handle...


Heavy crush has nothing to do with crushing infantry models. It's about which objects (mostly big hedgerows) it can crush.
15 Aug 2019, 10:07 AM
#65
avatar of WAAAGH2000

Posts: 658

Already nerf CommandPanzerIV aura,can we have a commandPanzerIV.J?
15 Aug 2019, 11:00 AM
#66
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2153

hmm..ok you nerf rakten that they cant Sneak around anymore..take away their retreat..and give them a 5. model and 55 range


where is instead a normal 60 range like other at guns and a green cover for models??
15 Aug 2019, 11:46 AM
#67
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17522 | Subs: 8


where is instead a normal 60 range like other at guns and a green cover for models??

At wehr.

Why do you want to make OKW identical to ost?
There already are barely any differences between them as is.
15 Aug 2019, 12:03 PM
#68
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

Hm I don't know about the split Schwere tech for OKW, especially having to rebuy the Panzer Authorization after you lose the schwere. As someone already pointed out, one of the main reasons people went with the Command p5 call in was because losing your schwere and rebuying it is way too big of an investment when having to buy a tank afterwards.

You guys basically take away the symptom whilst adding to the problem. That is literally allopathic medical world logic right there.
15 Aug 2019, 12:08 PM
#69
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

Hm I don't know about the split Schwere tech for OKW, especially having to rebuy the Panzer Authorization after you lose the schwere. As someone already pointed out, one of the main reasons people went with the Command p5 call in was because losing your schwere and rebuying it is way too big of an investment when having to buy a tank afterwards.

You guys basically take away the symptom whilst adding to the problem. That is literally allopathic medical world logic right there.


The net cost of the split SPHQ is the same.

Without the Jagdpanzer IV in the first half I think it's a little pointless, but it doesn't hurt in any way. You get LMG-less Obers a hair faster.
15 Aug 2019, 12:12 PM
#70
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2153

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 11:46 AMKatitof

At wehr.

Why do you want to make OKW identical to ost?
There already are barely any differences between them as is.


all i want is to bring rakten in line with all other AT guns…


take away retreat and moving camo isnt worth to get a 5. model and 5 range.


it would be ok if the get grenn cover Bonus, 60 range and still have 4 models. or 5/6 model with no cover Bonus.

buut now they are fragil like now but have no retreat...so they will still die when detected
15 Aug 2019, 12:14 PM
#71
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 12:08 PMLago


The net cost of the split SPHQ is the same.

Without the Jagdpanzer IV in the first half I think it's a little pointless, but it doesn't hurt in any way. You get LMG-less Obers a hair faster.


That is the point, it does cost the same as before. However, you now have NO choice when it comes to rebuiding it at full price, as the command p5 is gone (good nonetheless). This means the symptom, command p5 crutching and preference is gone and dealt with, but the real main cause of this, is still here: full on price to rebuild schwere and then having to build a tank again. That is way too expensive. This means no aggressive schwere placement ever again and it just sitting in base.
15 Aug 2019, 12:15 PM
#72
avatar of Dangerous-Cloth

Posts: 2066

I like what Dane said in his analysis of the patch for the UKF vickers. It has too slow tracking or traverse speed. Can't this be tweaked? MG42 suffers from this somewhat too!
15 Aug 2019, 12:21 PM
#73
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

That is the point, it does cost the same as before. However, you now have NO choice when it comes to rebuiding it at full price, as the command p5 is gone (good nonetheless). This means the symptom, command p5 crutching and preference is gone and dealt with, but the real main cause of this, is still here: full on price to rebuild schwere and then having to build a tank again. That is way too expensive. This means no aggressive schwere placement ever again and it just sitting in base.


I think you're oversimplifying the Command Panther problem a bit, but I get the sentiment.

I personally think it should be a 60/60 fuel split, and the JPIV should be in the first half.

That gives Battlegroup builds decently fast access to a solid anti-tank vehicle, solves the long standing JPIV/Panther redundancy problem, and gives OKW players who lose their SPHQ a second comeback option instead of just the King Tiger.
15 Aug 2019, 12:34 PM
#74
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3085 | Subs: 7

As someone already pointed out, one of the main reasons people went with the Command p5 call in was because losing your schwere and rebuying it is way too big of an investment when having to buy a tank afterwards.


No one is forcing players to build their SPHQ on the front line though. If you like producing tanks, then put it somewhere safe or somewhere you're certain you can defend it. There's no need to continue to give OKW a free map denial tool without a big risk attached to it. And OKW still has the now improved King Tiger if they lose the SPHQ, anyway.
15 Aug 2019, 12:38 PM
#75
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

it would be ok if the get grenn cover Bonus, 60 range and still have 4 models. or 5/6 model with no cover Bonus.


Let me tell you a secret. The cake is a lie, the same with the shield. Unless mod team is able to put an invisible wall and change the model, giving the rak cover properties won't do anything at all. What helps other At guns is that they have a bigger model, but that only helps against tank shells.
15 Aug 2019, 12:46 PM
#76
avatar of Smartie

Posts: 831 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Aug 2019, 12:21 PMLago


I think you're oversimplifying the Command Panther problem a bit, but I get the sentiment.

I personally think it should be a 60/60 fuel split, and the JPIV should be in the first half.

That gives Battlegroup builds decently fast access to a solid anti-tank vehicle, solves the long standing JPIV/Panther redundancy problem, and gives OKW players who lose their SPHQ a second comeback option instead of just the King Tiger.


+1
15 Aug 2019, 13:01 PM
#77
avatar of Lago

Posts: 3260

No one is forcing players to build their SPHQ on the front line though. If you like producing tanks, then put it somewhere safe or somewhere you're certain you can defend it. There's no need to continue to give OKW a free map denial tool without a big risk attached to it. And OKW still has the now improved King Tiger if they lose the SPHQ, anyway.


It does seem like something a trap unit now. It screams 'put me on your fuel or cutoff' at you despite that being a stupidly risky thing to do.


Game: "hey, this HQ has a huge fuck off gun on it, isn't that great?"

Player 1: "cool i'll put it somewhere it does something"

Player 2: blows it up

Game: "aha, FOOL! you fell for my cunning ploy! i hope you like stalling for a KING TIGER! ahahahahaha"

Player 1: " :'( "



This might be a bit radical for a balance patch, but have you considered this?

  • Swap models of Schwerer Panzer Headquarters and Mechanized Regiment Headquarters.
  • Gun stats on Mechanized Regiment Headquarters changed to match buildable OKW Flak Emplacement.
  • Gun must be upgraded to enable it.

That way, the two trucks you'd actually want to put on the field are the ones you can afford to lose.
15 Aug 2019, 13:17 PM
#78
avatar of Balanced_Gamer

Posts: 783

can i ask what the point of this ?
Cost from 200MP/120 to 100/80; unlocks Obersoldaten and the doctrinal Hetzer; Obersoldaten upgrades locked behind Panzer Authorization.

nobody is gonna build it for penals for 80 fuel (mg is still locked in the last tier) as they are literally the only unit in that tier


I do not know if Obers can do much of an effect without the MG.

Is it actually good without the MG, what do you guys think?

Honestly, I do not think they could have much of an impact without the MG. It is like getting grens combined with their MG42 upgrade except worse than that. Obers with only k98 is worse than an upgraded grenadier according to stats.

https://coh2db.com/stats/#65
"select, Faction then Osteehr, Infantry then Grenadier, select under "grenadiers_mp" find the 1:_grenadier_mg42lmg_mp.

It will show the DPS which is in contrast far better than Obers without any upgrades.


https://coh2db.com/stats/#132 "Find OKWs Obersoldaten".

Why even get Obers unupgraded?

Obers definitely has better RA than Grens but all in all, is it worth purchasing without the MG.

Maybe I am wrong but I am curious as to what you guys have to say.

Overall, I am happy that they changing to make it possible to arrive earlier




15 Aug 2019, 13:22 PM
#79
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17522 | Subs: 8



I do not know if Obers can do much of an effect without the MG.

Is it actually good without the MG, what do you guys think?

Are tommies good without upgrades?

Obers are stronger.
15 Aug 2019, 13:27 PM
#80
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

DO tommy cost 340 mp and 120 fu at least to unlock ?
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