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15 minute Tiger/Tiger Ace in 4v4

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20 Jun 2019, 04:03 AM
#1
avatar of VonIvan

Posts: 2396 | Subs: 22

This seems to be a recurring balance issue. Technically allies don't have heavy tanks they can spawn at this time anymore. So they must rely on rushing out tank destroyers/at-gun walls or try and camp the VP and win within 30 minutes. The patch has only been out for almost a week but I'm curious if 4v4 players are having a hard time finding solutions to this issue.
20 Jun 2019, 04:25 AM
#2
avatar of A. Soldier
Social Media Manager Badge

Posts: 2717 | Subs: 2

Well I tried spamming M10s as the Brits but to no avail, Tiger Ace was covered by MGs and mortars as well as AT guns and by the time I got 3 Achilles out the guy had Panthers supporting it as well. Doesn't help that my old bad experience of playing against other people from CoH came back where I was called a noob for spamming M10s by my teammates who were getting pushed back hard and our opponents who were having the time of their lives rolfatomping us and just had to rub more salt in the wound like always.
20 Jun 2019, 05:01 AM
#3
avatar of murky depths

Posts: 598

Yeah, basically.

It's... not pleasant. It would be one thing if the commanders were a specific gimmick/theme, but both axis commanders have enough to be a proper meta commander.

20 Jun 2019, 08:18 AM
#4
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 6391 | Subs: 1

imo many powerful units come too early in the game. The timing of units arrival needs an overhaul imo.
20 Jun 2019, 08:28 AM
#5
avatar of SuperHansFan

Posts: 331

Give Soviets 14 min ISU and double Shrek partisans so they can troll back

Basically instead of nerfing stuff repeatedly until it sees no use lets balance OP with OP like the good old days. Old B4 precision shot meta vs KT anyone?
20 Jun 2019, 09:04 AM
#6
avatar of capiqua
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 974 | Subs: 2

And the sixth year they put one more row to the wall of late and super late game of the axis. Hard to jump that wall, increasing the difficulty in teamgames.

This patch is allied inf spam and axis tank spam.

Welcome to coh2
20 Jun 2019, 09:26 AM
#7
avatar of Kirrik

Posts: 555

Ostwind is bigger issue, those things are far deadlier than a Tiger
20 Jun 2019, 09:34 AM
#8
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 1960 | Subs: 3

If Allies suspect a Tiger rush, they can get TDs out as their first tanks and nullify a Tiger or Tiger Ace by kiting it. Early Tiger is not an instant win (unless Allies were really losing anyway) as it won't have any good support. People are adapting already and it's becoming much less powerful. Will have to wait to see where it eventually settles.
20 Jun 2019, 09:37 AM
#9
avatar of WAAAGH2000

Posts: 314

It is time to released all Heavy Tank be Tech Request!And then can balance them at cost CD or other way
20 Jun 2019, 09:40 AM
#10
avatar of SupremeStefan

Posts: 868

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jun 2019, 08:18 AMVipper
imo many powerful units come too early in the game. The timing of units arrival needs an overhaul imo.
Sooo many units .. why can admit that this one is simple op in teamgames ? Pls can u focus on that because i feel your next post will be about jackson arive too early too or woverine
20 Jun 2019, 10:00 AM
#11
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 13771 | Subs: 7

I just like the fact that this issue completely invalidates all the "allied TDs are OP REEEEEE" threads, because now they are more needed in that state then ever.
Sooo many units .. why can admit that this one is simple op in teamgames ? Pls can u focus on that because i feel your next post will be about jackson arive too early too or woverine

Rule #1, can't condemn axis units, because krupp steel.
20 Jun 2019, 10:49 AM
#12
avatar of Hannibal
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 492

The new thing is that the Tiger now has a good chance to come very early if you try to save for it.
T4 plus heavy tank costs approx 400 fuel, (15 mins with 27 fuel income, but realistically it's about 20 min) and in team games even earlier as less points are cut off and due to caches.

Earlier, it always was 13 CP, which you would not reach before ~20 min.
20 Jun 2019, 10:57 AM
#13
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 6391 | Subs: 1

Sooo many units .. why can admit that this one is simple op in teamgames ? Pls can u focus on that because i feel your next post will be about jackson arive too early too or woverine

Pls can you focus on what I post and NOT what you guess I will post about.
20 Jun 2019, 11:23 AM
#14
avatar of Puppetmaster
Patrion 310

Posts: 871

10 min is my record for okw tiger so far, with fuel drop and caches. Also had 4x 13 min tigers (mix of ace and okw). Generally allies won't have a td out at the same time unless they skipped all side tech to rush it. Okw can manage pretty easy without side tech which is half of the problem. Ost it's a bit harder but it's possible to get away with mg, assgren and shreck pzgrens.

Either they need a Cp requirement or require all tech to be build like current kt
20 Jun 2019, 11:50 AM
#15
avatar of Warspite

Posts: 45

Permanently Banned
Its not just 4v4. Its the same meta in 3v3
20 Jun 2019, 12:03 PM
#16
avatar of Hannibal
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 492

But actually why is that so?
If Axis are able to buy a 230 fuel unit after teching to T4, Allies should be able to get a 130-140 fuel unit out as well. Unless you really screwed up your early to mid game, but then it's okay if the opponent fortifies a strong position.
20 Jun 2019, 12:20 PM
#17
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 6391 | Subs: 1

The claim that M36 need to be OP because a doctrinal unit like the Tiger or OKW is OP is simply flawed.

If they Tiger are op they should be fixed. If the m36 are also OP they should also be fixed.
20 Jun 2019, 12:21 PM
#18
avatar of Sturmpanther
Lead Strategist Badge

Posts: 4846 | Subs: 16

The problem is:

Many people in 4vs4 skip as allies light vehicles to get fast arty or tank out.
Also many people just camp, when they have half the map, which is also bad idea now.
--> As allies get vehicles out and push.

And it depends on the map.
On Steppe i don't care for a tiger rush for example. But you can't do that anyway there. Same on redball.

Where this tactic works well is:
liene forest, vielsam and lanzerath ambush. Because there you have a save fuel income.


But yes we need to make 1 more stuff to avoid this fast rush.
The balance team is thinking atm.

But the plan was to get away from CP needed.
20 Jun 2019, 12:33 PM
#19
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1493 | Subs: 3

The problem is:

Many people in 4vs4 skip as allies light vehicles to get fast arty or tank out.
Also many people just camp, when they have half the map, which is also bad idea now.
--> As allies get vehicles out and push.

And it depends on the map.
On Steppe i don't care for a tiger rush for example. But you can't do that anyway there. Same on redball.

Where this tactic works well is:
liene forest, vielsam and lanzerath ambush. Because there you have a save fuel income.


But yes we need to make 1 more stuff to avoid this fast rush.
The balance team is thinking atm.

But the plan was to get away from CP needed.


In team games, light tanks are useless, it will be destroyed almost instantly or it will not be useful (A large number of AT guns), so players expect medium tanks or heavy ones for Germany because they are now available at the same time as medium ones. So the most realistic scenario is to make heavy tanks come later than the medium ones but not too late: by the end of the game or when you have the resources, but in heavy tanks there is no point.
20 Jun 2019, 12:34 PM
#20
avatar of YeltsinDeathBrigades

Posts: 60

Can you prove it somehow?
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