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Should engis be able to destroy cover?

15 May 2019, 05:37 AM
#1
avatar of cochosgo

Posts: 258

Last weekend the question if engineers of all factions should be able to blow up cover came to my mind

Why? There are some maps were fences or some kind of yellow cover dictates paths of movement for your units. Infantry can vault over and move up, just a bit of micro-tax, however support weapons can't, which becomes problematic on some maps, like vaux farmlands north eastern side, which forces weapon teams to take important roundabouts to position themselves. This problem its also present on the south western side, to a lesser extent.

This particular example was noted by the developers as a problem of the map by the time of the last map revamp, however, a vaux rework was set aside on favor of maps in a noticeable worst state.

While my idea its more like a get-around the problems of map design, it will certainly affect other aspects of gameplay as well. And that's one of the key problems: Players would be able to change the map and certain engagements would work differently as intended by the map makers.

For example: Rails and metal central VP has two sets of yellow cover on each side. Being able to rush it and destroy cover on the oponent side would alter the flow of the early movements.

Miragefla even noted that we could even see engineers that could pretty much charge alongside mainlines and blow up the defenders cover right below their noses (and this is why afterwards I choose to limit my original idea to just yellow cover)

You could balance it out by delaying the arrival of this particular ability/upgrade (maybe tie it with the hazard removal package) as of now, its exclusive to british royal engineers which are available at tier2...but that would also mean straying of its original intent as a workaround to some map design problems.

Maybe you can think of a way it could work it out, but first, one has to find the right answer to Should engineers be able to remove cover? I think my answer is not strong enough

15 May 2019, 08:21 AM
#2
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 5229 | Subs: 1

R.E. engineers have the ability and for good reason. So that they can create space for emplacements.

The ability is also available to Assault Engineer and will become available to pioneers in the next patch.

The ability is currently op since it can clear things like reinforced wire in allot less time than it take to built and can be used to increase the view of certain houses. The time to set the explosives and the cooldown is very low while imo it should not be "free".

Generally speaking the ability is very powerful and if it becomes available to more units it should be looked at.
15 May 2019, 12:15 PM
#3
avatar of Lago

Posts: 2275

I'd go the other way. No engineers can destroy cover.

It constrains map design severely.
15 May 2019, 15:38 PM
#4
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 2830

Nope, watching this be abused with certain garrisons and trenches with vet 1 vickers is enough for me. No one should have it.
16 May 2019, 01:15 AM
#5
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 2567

jump backJump back to quoted post15 May 2019, 12:15 PMLago
I'd go the other way. No engineers can destroy cover.

It constrains map design severely.

+1
16 May 2019, 05:04 AM
#6
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4333

jump backJump back to quoted post15 May 2019, 12:15 PMLago
I'd go the other way. No engineers can destroy cover.

It constrains map design severely.


Only problem with that is it's necessary for the positioning of certain emplacements on some maps. I had assumed this is why it was ever an option at all.
16 May 2019, 09:57 AM
#7
avatar of wuff

Posts: 1474 | Subs: 2

Nope, infact I would go as far as saying the R.E ability should be nerfed so it can only destroy light crush.

LOS is such a large and important mechanic that being able to remove LOS flanking routes etc just makes that mechanic redundant and ruins map design, since the most maps where designed before the Brits were introduced.
16 May 2019, 09:58 AM
#8
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 12900 | Subs: 6

jump backJump back to quoted post16 May 2019, 09:57 AMwuff
Nope, infact I would go as far as saying the R.E ability should be nerfed so it can only destroy light crush.

LOS is such a large and important mechanic that being able to remove LOS flanking routes etc just makes that mechanic redundant and ruins map design, since the most maps where designed before the Brits were introduced.

But you can already do that with vehicles.
Just drive over the cover.

Brits can do it with infantry earlier, because emplacements.
16 May 2019, 10:36 AM
#9
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 5229 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post16 May 2019, 09:57 AMwuff
Nope, infact I would go as far as saying the R.E ability should be nerfed so it can only destroy light crush.

LOS is such a large and important mechanic that being able to remove LOS flanking routes etc just makes that mechanic redundant and ruins map design, since the most maps where designed before the Brits were introduced.

The suggestion to light cover destruction makes sense.

In addition imo it needs longer time to set up longer cooldown and MU cost.
16 May 2019, 11:07 AM
#10
avatar of Lago

Posts: 2275

jump backJump back to quoted post16 May 2019, 10:36 AMVipper

The suggestion to light cover destruction makes sense.

In addition imo it needs longer time to set up longer cooldown and MU cost.


Yes to the first and the third. The cooldown should be ditched: all it does is stop you shift-queuing.
16 May 2019, 16:59 PM
#11
avatar of wuff

Posts: 1474 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post16 May 2019, 09:58 AMKatitof

But you can already do that with vehicles.
Just drive over the cover.

Brits can do it with infantry earlier, because emplacements.



I am not talking about cover, but crush size.

Heavy crush helps flanking, and yes a heavy can of course remove it but that is late game, Brits removing heavy crush affects the early / mid game which can suck.
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