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Ponary Forest - Spring Automatch Discussion

18 Apr 2019, 01:36 AM
#1
avatar of Tric
Master Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1422 | Subs: 3

For any discussion relevant to Ponary Forest, please use this.
18 Apr 2019, 08:56 AM
#2
avatar of Sturmpanther
Lead Strategist Badge

Posts: 5096 | Subs: 19

I can remember when i checked for Relic all 2vs2 maps for the contest.
I don't know, why Relic did not came to me again. I guess because they know that i am very busy atm.
Just some points I found, when i look into this map.


A) Wrong bunker place. You can walk easy into the base
http://prntscr.com/ndkco3

B) You can walk to the bunker and blow it up
http://prntscr.com/ndkduf

C) Caparea outside of the map
http://prntscr.com/ndkece

D) Maybe add some bushes in it? I know inf can't walk on it, but when you move your mouse over the map, it says there is alot of yellow cover.
http://prntscr.com/ndkg3z

E1) Why you can walk behind the house?
E2) You can't use the unit, because 2 are outside of the map. So you can't reteat them for example
http://prntscr.com/ndkiqq

F) This house can't shoot at north or south side. So only looking to the muni point.
Means its only useable and usefull for the right players. And useless for the left players.
http://prntscr.com/ndkkdh
G) Covering the whole fuel and muni side. Can't shoot at the fuel direct
--> Useless for left players
http://prntscr.com/ndkmpa

H) Can shoot at all directions. Left side can't easy attack this building. The door is favoured for right players
http://prntscr.com/ndknqt

I) greencover for right players while capping the fuel.
http://prntscr.com/ndkoeh

J) If you think of the right side house from point E/ F. Why this building can cover now muni AND fuel?
http://prntscr.com/ndkred

K) Middle Vp favours hard left side. Reasons:
I can have 3 paks left side shooting at the vps. Right side only 2. Because of the trees.
--> Remove the LoS blocker trees, to give more space for weaponteams
http://prntscr.com/ndkutk

L)I can't fall back with inf or tanks because there is a pit... RIP pathfing. While left side has big area to move.
http://prntscr.com/ndkwyx

M) This point feels way saver to hold then on the right side.
http://prntscr.com/ndkwme

N) I have the feeling this will be a good campstyle map. Reason: You have 1 vp, muni and fuel very close to each other and can protect it with mg in house.
I am personal always a fan, when muni and fuel are more seperate on the map.
From ressources I would always want to start in automatch right side and then go easy south side save. 1 MG in it and i have it.
From pathing middle, well ofc left side is way better. So for the latgamefights in the middle vp i prefer left side.

O) It has a (2) in his name. But its a 2vs2 map, right? --> (4)

So far for the first review. Enjoy B-)


18 Apr 2019, 13:12 PM
#4
avatar of Tric
Master Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1422 | Subs: 3

  • Bunkers Fixed
  • Bunker added (due to accidental deletion)
  • Building moved to stop units from going outside of the map
  • Buildings (2) damaged out to improve balance
  • Visual clutter removed
  • Small pathing adjustments around several areas
  • New path opened in south east area near strategy point to allow additional way out of the base area, as it is in the North
  • LOS blockers added in the east of the middle VP to mirror the west
  • Buildings that are left have been adjusted to see the same points, improving balance
  • Cover adjusted at fuels so they are fair
  • LOS blocker removed from south east side of middle VP to open it up more
  • Territory point outside the north west bases moved further into the middle of the map to be contestable

18 Apr 2019, 16:47 PM
#5
avatar of d0ggY
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 753 | Subs: 3

Funny to play, looks big but isn't really, some elevation which make it intresting, cut off play possible, teams can choose to do 1v1 on each side or to make it around mid and one other vp, could open a lot of nice matches between the different teams
18 Apr 2019, 16:51 PM
#6
avatar of Sturmpanther
Lead Strategist Badge

Posts: 5096 | Subs: 19

Played on the reworked version.

1) Not sure if i like it or not, that i can walk here and use mortar for example and cover the middle vp around.
http://prntscr.com/ndsh5i

2) Because of elevation your tanks / LV are save vs at guns. They will only miss
http://prntscr.com/ndshuc

3) Its hard to decapp on this side ( from behind, there are no big cutoff points. There is 1, but on the other side of the map not.
Example. You are the right player and enemy have south side. You need to decap to strategy points to cut them from south.
For left side north its 1 single cutoff. Its mirrowed for the right side.)

Commandos, Ranger, ASsgrens should be very well on this map.
18 Apr 2019, 16:55 PM
#7
avatar of Tric
Master Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 1422 | Subs: 3

Played on the reworked version.

1) Not sure if i like it or not, that i can walk here and use mortar for example and cover the middle vp around.
http://prntscr.com/ndsh5i

2) Because of elevation your tanks / LV are save vs at guns. They will only miss
http://prntscr.com/ndshuc

3) Its hard to decapp on this side ( from behind, there are no big cutoff points. There is 1, but on the other side of the map not.
Example. You are the right player and enemy have south side. You need to decap to strategy points to cut them from south.
For left side north its 1 single cutoff. Its mirrowed for the right side.)

Commandos, Ranger, ASsgrens should be very well on this map.


For your 1st point, that is easy fix, and 2nd fix I will place it as sight blockers a little more so there isn't so many shots into the rocks.

I will have to look into cutoff, maybe i messed it up when I moved the trouble point from before. Should be easy fix.
13 May 2019, 22:40 PM
#8
avatar of Gdot

Posts: 1136 | Subs: 1

Not a fan of this map.

Elevation changes
tough for OST
essentially (2) 1v1 games
bad for light vehicles
dominated by heavies bc of crush
too many trees and sight blockers

suggestions:
remove some patches of trees
open new paths for flanking
move muni or fuel point to make more of the map important
thin the forest
15 May 2019, 01:39 AM
#9
avatar of KoRneY

Posts: 364

Not a fan of this map. It's messy. The points on the extreme edge of the map are extremely vulnerable to directional air strikes. And there are a lot of points on the edge of the map.

All the shot blockers and crazy lanes are heaven for cqc blobs.

Thanks for the contribution but I have this one veto'd.
20 May 2019, 07:03 AM
#10
avatar of Stark

Posts: 590 | Subs: 1

It's a decent map but it needs some extra twicks:

1. Remove the no-man's-land - that's not needed. It may look good and make sense -you can't enter on this area so why should have it BUT it confuses the player, it's hard to navigate on tactical map and minimap and figure out which point connects which.
2. There is plenty of trees on the mountains which makes a lot of screen space. It's better to replace part of them with heavy bushes. It will allow players to better see their units. There is no need for so many details (though it looks really nice).
3.Expend the mid south passage between hills, currently it's really narrow so light vehicules have hard time moving there. It would be fine but the top and south side aren't really open as well. Extra space for lights won't hurt.
4. I would add some green cover - trenches near the bases directed into the mid VP to allow players to easier defend their closest sectors,
5. Stumpanther 1st point - if this stays then i suggest to make vertical passages between hills to better move with infantry.
I WILL ADD MORE LATER
1 Jul 2019, 15:52 PM
#11
avatar of Sturmpanther
Lead Strategist Badge

Posts: 5096 | Subs: 19

jump backJump back to quoted post1 Jul 2019, 14:31 PMstuve
Was playing this strange looking map today, i havent played in 2 months but by god was i apalled.

The Elevation alone is reason to give this map a bad review, any decent/experienced map maker knows how elevation is bad for vehicle targeting yet tric makes this monstrosity? is it to mock the community? how did relic approve of this abomination and counter artistic creation.

not only is the map infected with a rollercoaster type of elevation from west to east
Its like a big ant nest with a thousand channels between a tree stump heaven to block light vehicles

https://imgur.com/a/7T8yhIH


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