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russian armor

Falls should need munition to upgrade fg42

15 Apr 2019, 14:10 PM
#21
avatar of SeductiveCardbordBox

Posts: 546 | Subs: 1


Which would be a little awkward if you wanted Thompson paras wouldn't it?


They also don't drop with thompsons, but the point remains that there have been a long series of adjustments to bring all troops that arrive behind the lines down in terms of their strike potential.

JLI had to upgrade when they could infiltrate.
Stormtroops need to buy an assault package.
Infiltration Commandos now have a grenade cooldown timer and next to no men.
Glider commandos do three loops of the map in a huge glider with associated minimap icon and need a huge landing strip.
Paratroopers need to buy a weapon upgrade.


(Patrisans suck so hard they've never been touched.)

They're also an outlier because they're elite infantry with long range firepower that has no MU requirement. Paras, Obers, Guards - they all have their MU cost.


But as I said before, it's not a high priority thing to address. They're fantastic infantry but the commander's still off meta and other things need much more urgent fixes in the OKW lineup alone.
15 Apr 2019, 14:31 PM
#22
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 3267 | Subs: 1



They also don't drop with thompsons, but the point remains that there have been a long series of adjustments to bring all troops that arrive behind the lines down in terms of their strike potential.

JLI had to upgrade when they could infiltrate.
Stormtroops need to buy an assault package.
Infiltration Commandos now have a grenade cooldown timer and next to no men.
Glider commandos do three loops of the map in a huge glider with associated minimap icon and need a huge landing strip.
Paratroopers need to buy a weapon upgrade.


(Patrisans suck so hard they've never been touched.)

They're also an outlier because they're elite infantry with long range firepower that has no MU requirement. Paras, Obers, Guards - they all have their MU cost.


But as I said before, it's not a high priority thing to address. They're fantastic infantry but the commander's still off meta and other things need much more urgent fixes in the OKW lineup alone.

Falls come in as a package because they are squishy as hell. Paras are designed to be able to recrew their air dropped weapons and can reinforce at a beacon making their map control very dominant because they never bloody leave it.
Falls are as glassy and as cannoney as it gets. Despite being multiple airborne type units all of them are unique. Due to the air drop there is plenty of warning now.it was problematic when they were infiltration units but they are no longer.
15 Apr 2019, 20:13 PM
#23
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1179



I don't revive the Falls to have 5 or 6 people, but then FG-42 should be reworked: it is long to become a BAR analog, 5-6 people with KAR98K and two FG-42, FG-42 was made in very small quantities and KAK98K It was still the main weapon of the German paratroopers, the FG-42 served mainly the same role as the BAR - a light support weapon.


Production number is irrelevant in COH 2, US produced 650k m3 and m3a1 grease gun, 50k less than FG42, and still assault enfineers have up to 5 models with those weapons.
15 Apr 2019, 20:27 PM
#24
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4002



They also don't drop with thompsons, but the point remains that there have been a long series of adjustments to bring all troops that arrive behind the lines down in terms of their strike potential.

JLI had to upgrade when they could infiltrate.
Stormtroops need to buy an assault package.
Infiltration Commandos now have a grenade cooldown timer and next to no men.
Glider commandos do three loops of the map in a huge glider with associated minimap icon and need a huge landing strip.
Paratroopers need to buy a weapon upgrade.


(Patrisans suck so hard they've never been touched.)

They're also an outlier because they're elite infantry with long range firepower that has no MU requirement. Paras, Obers, Guards - they all have their MU cost.


But as I said before, it's not a high priority thing to address. They're fantastic infantry but the commander's still off meta and other things need much more urgent fixes in the OKW lineup alone.
and falls like para die when they drop if u are not careful
15 Apr 2019, 20:30 PM
#25
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1499 | Subs: 3

FG-42 was extremely complex and extremely expensive to manufacture, which, along with the delay in its establishment, caused very little: 10-12 thousand were produced and it was used not only by Parachutists, it was used by all military branches: Luftwaffe, Wehrmacht, SS.
15 Apr 2019, 20:38 PM
#26
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1179

FG-42 was extremely complex and extremely expensive to manufacture, which, along with the delay in its establishment, caused very little: 10-12 thousand were produced and it was used not only by Parachutists, it was used by all military branches: Luftwaffe, Wehrmacht, SS.


And m3 grease gun were issued to vehicle crews. Going by equipment numbers, assault engineers would have at best m1 carbines. Not to speak that a lot were sent with lend lease.
15 Apr 2019, 20:48 PM
#27
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 13805 | Subs: 7

FG-42 was extremely complex and extremely expensive to manufacture, which, along with the delay in its establishment, caused very little: 10-12 thousand were produced and it was used not only by Parachutists, it was used by all military branches: Luftwaffe, Wehrmacht, SS.

I'll add another trivia about FG-42. The weapon had a kick. And I mean A KICK, it was impossible to accurately fire at anything smaller then a barn at close range using full auto.
15 Apr 2019, 20:54 PM
#28
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1179

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Apr 2019, 20:48 PMKatitof

I'll add another trivia about FG-42. The weapon had a kick. And I mean A KICK, it was impossible to accurately fire at anything smaller then a barn at close range using full auto.


Yeah...no

https://youtu.be/7x6LibuC4N0

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FG_42

"The FG 42 was a select-fire air-cooled weapon and one of the first to incorporate the "straight-line" recoil configuration. This layout, combined with the side magazine, placed both the center of gravity and the position of the shoulder stock nearly in line with the longitudinal axis of the bore, a feature increasing controllability during burst or automatic fire."



15 Apr 2019, 21:00 PM
#29
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1499 | Subs: 3



Yeah...no

https://youtu.be/7x6LibuC4N0

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FG_42

"The FG 42 was a select-fire air-cooled weapon and one of the first to incorporate the "straight-line" recoil configuration. This layout, combined with the side magazine, placed both the center of gravity and the position of the shoulder stock nearly in line with the longitudinal axis of the bore, a feature increasing controllability during burst or automatic fire."





The video shows that shooting from the hands is not so controlled, it is typical for all automatic rifles for a powerful cartridge (even modern ones), but as a light machine gun with bipod - which it was originally designed, it is a good weapon, as a result FG-42 performed same role as BAR1918A2.
15 Apr 2019, 21:07 PM
#30
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1179



The video shows that shooting from the hands is not so controlled, it is typical for all automatic rifles for a powerful cartridge (even modern ones), but as a light machine gun with bipod - which it was originally designed, it is a good weapon, as a result FG-42 performed same role as BAR1918A2.


If you think that recoil for a full caliber rifle is not "controlled" you probably never fired a weapon yourself... that's 5.56 level of controllability for 3 round bursts.

Compare it with this then

https://youtu.be/xtx12dzs5n8

Guy shoot all over the target by several degrees after the first shot
15 Apr 2019, 21:17 PM
#31
avatar of Crecer13

Posts: 1499 | Subs: 3



If you think that recoil for a full caliber rifle is not "controlled" you probably never fired a weapon yourself... that's 5.56 level of controllability for 3 round bursts.

Compare it with this then

https://youtu.be/xtx12dzs5n8

Guy shoot all over the target by several degrees after the first shot


I love weapons and I shot a shotgun and AK-74M in automatic mode, but 5.45x39 is a softer recoil than 5.56x45
15 Apr 2019, 21:27 PM
#32
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1179



I love weapons and I shot a shotgun and AK-74M in automatic mode, but 5.45x39 is a softer recoil than 5.56x45


Ever fired an Akm ? Is a 7.62 and has similar kick. The FG42 is actually heaviers, a 7.92

The 5.45 was intended to be a light caliber that would have made the ak a very accurate rifle to be fired in automatic and burst fure, so you are used to an assault rifle, very advanced as well (arguably more accurate than most Nato counterpart), and the plastick stock is also definetly helpful. Ak74M, while older than other rifles, is arguably top tier military grade equipment.
15 Apr 2019, 21:47 PM
#33
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 3267 | Subs: 1

https://youtu.be/vw3eKWvDGqQ
Literally a trial comparison between the fg42 and BAR if yall want gun Jesus to tell you about it. Disclosure havnt watched this in years just linking it
15 Apr 2019, 22:10 PM
#34
avatar of Vuther
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3087 | Subs: 1

Ya'll need Gun Jesus

Posted solely for my own amusement
15 Apr 2019, 22:14 PM
#35
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 3236 | Subs: 1

Keep off the real world FG42 stuff. Talk about falls INGAME
16 Apr 2019, 22:58 PM
#36
avatar of Flyingsmonster

Posts: 125

Another option is to go the stormtroopers route, in that they don't spawn with the FG-42, but you need to upgrade to them when they land for no charge, so that there's a slight delay in their DPS.
17 Apr 2019, 00:13 AM
#37
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 3267 | Subs: 1

Another option is to go the stormtroopers route, in that they don't spawn with the FG-42, but you need to upgrade to them when they land for no charge, so that there's a slight delay in their DPS.

Except falls don't have the same delivery that storms had. Which was instant. Falls air drop giving ample warning
17 Apr 2019, 00:32 AM
#38
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 1554

I don't see any reason they shouldn't have to upgrade. Even if it's free I don't see why it's okay with them to drop with all-range effective weapons.

They get a snare, it's not like Paras have every advantage.
17 Apr 2019, 02:26 AM
#39
avatar of distrofio

Posts: 1690

Because falls are meant to close the gaps between your mainline inf strenght and the enemy least favourable fighting distance.

Falls are expensive AF and fragile unless vetted. They are an expensive tool not meant to crude infantry combat but flanking and ambushing weaker targets.

If their weapons werent as good, ambushing would take ages and the other player would easly retreat.

Simpler minds would send them like lambs to the slaugther and find them frustated in both ways, why they cant win face to face combat and why they have overperforming guns
17 Apr 2019, 04:26 AM
#40
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 3267 | Subs: 1

I don't see any reason they shouldn't have to upgrade. Even if it's free I don't see why it's okay with them to drop with all-range effective weapons.

They get a snare, it's not like Paras have every advantage.

Paras have the advantage of durability, being the most durable usf squad but also the ability to reinforce on field via beacon. Falls are made of glass but hit like a truck. They do not infiltrate so there is no requirement for the upgrade. You might as well just make them drop in slower for all that great" change would do. I see literally no purpose in it, especially if it's free. Should commandos have to upgrade? I'd say that an extra man and the ability to reinforce if done well is equal to long range dps no?
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