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My Balance thoughts on Revamp Mech Company

2 Oct 2018, 05:06 AM
#1
avatar of TwistedTootsy

Posts: 30

WC51 Changes
Coming from me, I know it might sound bad, but the WC51 being able to get an MG for 45 munitions was a needed buff, while the nerf of making it come out later is appropriate. I'm indifferent towards it being able to capture points because I've always done that by just decrewing it when I don't have other squads nearby.

Halftrack and Assault Engineers
Removing ass engies from this doctrine was a big hit though, but also understandable. It granted demo charges, 30 muni mines, and flamethrowers to a faction that doesn't even have 1 of these 3 normally in any other doctrine. Although it saddens me, this is okay from a balance standpoint for the exchange of cavalry riflemen which also have unique utility, just not as much.

Cavalry Riflemen and their Abilities
So they have access to ONLY the penal anti vehicle satchel and not a default satchel. I'm fine with this, as adding the default satchel would give HUGE anti building utility to USF at 1 CP. Their performance is equivalent to assault grenadiers and slightly less than pgrens at anything not closee range which I suppose is expectable as they come out 1 cp sooner than assgrens and even better with their thompsons. They've also got smoke that isn't attached to grenade tech and the suppressive fire ability from paratroopers. They don't even need an upgrade to use it. This doesn't really make sense for a close range squad ability to do this ability at long range. It'd unnecessarily overpowered so I'd remove it. I honestly never use smoke so I can't judge the smoke grenade ability, although I foresee me using it now.

EDIT: Forgot to add this, but I'd nerf the timer on the satchel charges. I'd actually make them at least 2 seconds longer to avoid the play of just driving by a vehicle, dismounting the riflemen and throwing a satchel. At least this way the player with the vehicle being satchelled has a greater time to react and get away to avoid over the top cheese. The vehicle would still be eventually disabled and probably behind enemy lines, but then the quick and deep strike nature of Mech company would be able to compensate for this and attack it.

M76 Sherman tank changes
I used to think that this wasn't appropriate because I always thought the 76 Sherman outperformed the p4. But testing the two tanks in a slugfest actually resulted in the p4 winning most of the time in slugfests medium and long range. I suppose this is okay but I wouldn't mind at all if it was reverted to 135.


Honestly, I see Mechanized Company becoming actually meta now. The reason I play Mech company basically every game was because it was so fun, because it was literally a glass cannon that could lose you the game in an instant and was very exhilarating.

ABOUT DAMN TIME
2 Oct 2018, 05:38 AM
#2
avatar of miragefla
Senior Modmaker Badge

Posts: 1288 | Subs: 14



Cavalry Riflemen and their Abilities
This doesn't really make sense for a close range squad ability to do this ability at long range. It'd unnecessarily overpowered so I'd remove it. I honestly never use smoke so I can't judge the smoke grenade ability, although I foresee me using it now.



The idea behind Covering Fire, which is nothing like what Paras or RE use in their Volley/Suppressive Fire, is that you trade out the squad's combat potential to shutdown a unit you can't reliably close distance with, but you can support another unit moving in or stopping a major threat temporarily. The stats are that the Cavalry Rifles take a 90% accuracy penalty while the enemy takes 75% and their speed is reduced to walking.

On the 76mm tank's changes, what would you say about the HVAP ability? Not standard ammo.
2 Oct 2018, 16:20 PM
#3
avatar of TwistedTootsy

Posts: 30



The idea behind Covering Fire, which is nothing like what Paras or RE use in their Volley/Suppressive Fire, is that you trade out the squad's combat potential to shutdown a unit you can't reliably close distance with, but you can support another unit moving in or stopping a major threat temporarily. The stats are that the Cavalry Rifles take a 90% accuracy penalty while the enemy takes 75% and their speed is reduced to walking.

On the 76mm tank's changes, what would you say about the HVAP ability? Not standard ammo.



So I tested the HVAP rounds. They are observedly useless on infantry on direct hit, unlike sherman anti-tank rounds which have a small blast radius but still damage on direct hit on infantry. I can understand this. I'm a fan of ammo switching because its a skill based ability and is easily predictable when playing against. There's a big difference between a M4 Shermans ammo switch and less between the 76 Sherman. Ex. An M4 sherman will hardly ever penetrate the front armor of a luchs while in HE mode, but a 76 will penetrate regardless of ammo type.

Also I tested the HVAP rounds and.... They 90% of the time penetrate the front armor of a panther at max range (during slug testing) while having roughly the same fire rate as the panther (not to mention the accuracy boost hvap rounds give.) Of course, the panther has a longer range and better armor and health still. If the 76 shermans were to keep this HVAP round ability I'd actually bump up the price to 135 fuel 380 Manpower and they'd still be totally worth it for the consistent hits and penetrations. This is currently almost the same fuel price as a jackson but instead of long range anti tank you would have medium range anti tank with anti infantry as well with the 76 Sherman. Without the HVAP round I'd agree that 125 fuel is an okay price since it would be on equal footing with the p4
10 Oct 2018, 04:07 AM
#4
avatar of LeOverlord

Posts: 306

WC51 Changes
Coming from me, I know it might sound bad, but the WC51 being able to get an MG for 45 munitions was a needed buff, while the nerf of making it come out later is appropriate. I'm indifferent towards it being able to capture points because I've always done that by just decrewing it when I don't have other squads nearby.

Halftrack and Assault Engineers
Removing ass engies from this doctrine was a big hit though, but also understandable. It granted demo charges, 30 muni mines, and flamethrowers to a faction that doesn't even have 1 of these 3 normally in any other doctrine. Although it saddens me, this is okay from a balance standpoint for the exchange of cavalry riflemen which also have unique utility, just not as much.

Cavalry Riflemen and their Abilities
So they have access to ONLY the penal anti vehicle satchel and not a default satchel. I'm fine with this, as adding the default satchel would give HUGE anti building utility to USF at 1 CP. Their performance is equivalent to assault grenadiers and slightly less than pgrens at anything not closee range which I suppose is expectable as they come out 1 cp sooner than assgrens and even better with their thompsons. They've also got smoke that isn't attached to grenade tech and the suppressive fire ability from paratroopers. They don't even need an upgrade to use it. This doesn't really make sense for a close range squad ability to do this ability at long range. It'd unnecessarily overpowered so I'd remove it. I honestly never use smoke so I can't judge the smoke grenade ability, although I foresee me using it now.

EDIT: Forgot to add this, but I'd nerf the timer on the satchel charges. I'd actually make them at least 2 seconds longer to avoid the play of just driving by a vehicle, dismounting the riflemen and throwing a satchel. At least this way the player with the vehicle being satchelled has a greater time to react and get away to avoid over the top cheese. The vehicle would still be eventually disabled and probably behind enemy lines, but then the quick and deep strike nature of Mech company would be able to compensate for this and attack it.

M76 Sherman tank changes
I used to think that this wasn't appropriate because I always thought the 76 Sherman outperformed the p4. But testing the two tanks in a slugfest actually resulted in the p4 winning most of the time in slugfests medium and long range. I suppose this is okay but I wouldn't mind at all if it was reverted to 135.


Honestly, I see Mechanized Company becoming actually meta now. The reason I play Mech company basically every game was because it was so fun, because it was literally a glass cannon that could lose you the game in an instant and was very exhilarating.

ABOUT DAMN TIME


About Cavalry Riflemen, having a satchel charge is a good thing, and the timing (i think it's 4 seconds before detonation) is fine (in CoH1, sticky grenades had the same timer). It will give one more tool against vehicles without the need to tech weapon racks early on. The animation though seems to be very fast, compared to mainline Riflemen's rifle grenade which has a very long animation. Covering fire will be good against OKW's Obers and Stumps.
10 Oct 2018, 11:33 AM
#5
avatar of BeastHunter

Posts: 186

Could the M3 movement speed be looked at? Currently it is the most interesting unit the doctrine has to offer as it allows the bazooka (+ minesweeper) tank hunter that might dive deep behind enemy lines and can escape due to the ridiculous speed if you use all the available speed buffs: vet2 (passive +30% like other halftracks) roads (+ 50% all other vehicles) and the one that disturbs me the vet 1 ability that offers +75% more maximum speed for 20s with 8s cooldown without any costs! I think the drawback of not using its main gun is just about right for the WC51 which usually uses its maingun and might need the ability to escape with its low armor value compared to m3a1 or UC, but the m3 halftrack could maybe use a bit different vet1 ability that maybe just boosts the acceleration and the received accuracy like the soviet ability "Overdrive" maybe the vet1 ability could be somewhere in between offering better acceleration and better maximum speed for a small symbolic cost (10 muni) while having both at reduced levels (for example +30% acceleration + 35% maximum speed maybe stop the main gun from firing and lower the received accuracy a bit) the cooldown could also be raised to the abilities lenght to allow the chasing of slowed vehicles that drove deep in enemy territory.
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