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"balancing" discussions are ALL pointless

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2 Oct 2018, 17:08 PM
#81
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053



This is why i don't want to have any kind of advice or conversation with "pros". Everything comes around "learning to play"

A lot of it really does though. And that’s an area pros are very useful in giving advice. It astounds me that there’s so much hostility towards the opinions of the people who are objectively the best in the world at this game as a whole.
2 Oct 2018, 18:00 PM
#82
avatar of LeOverlord

Posts: 310


A lot of it really does though. And that’s an area pros are very useful in giving advice. It astounds me that there’s so much hostility towards the opinions of the people who are objectively the best in the world at this game as a whole.


There's a reason people are hostile towards them. Give advice, do it in a gentle manner. When you go to get a job, the boss doesn't tell you "learn how to work". He TEACHES you. He's there to answer your questions, help you do something a little bit better than you previously did. This is how you teach/advise someone. Does this thing exist in this forum? No, not at all.

I don't degrade Imperial Dane and every Imperial Dane when i say i don't like him. I don't like his attitude, i never questioned his ability as a player. I have watched his streams and i like how he plays (his playstyle as Wehr is what i want to deal with when i play games, not the irritating MG spam i see in my rank). But when he starts the shit about balance, i really wish i could punch him in the face.
2 Oct 2018, 18:34 PM
#83
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2



This is why i don't want to have any kind of advice or conversation with "pros". Everything comes around "learning to play"


"Pro caster", not pro player. I do enjoy his videos but there should be a reminder that the channel is called PROPAGANDAcast for a reason.

This is how you teach/advise someone. Does this thing exist in this forum? No, not at all.


https://www.coh2.org/forum/2/state-office

Shame that most REAL pro players have already burn out through out the years.



2 Oct 2018, 18:58 PM
#84
avatar of sluzbenik

Posts: 878



"Pro caster", not pro player. I do enjoy his videos but there should be a reminder that the channel is called PROPAGANDAcast for a reason.



https://www.coh2.org/forum/2/state-office

Shame that most REAL pro players have already burn out through out the years.





Not a surprise given how many crazy changes the game has gone through. People get sicking of #adapting.

I played COH1 from very early on, I sort of remember one major patch that changed the game pre PE but that was only once, and it was nothing like the constant relearning you have to do with COH2 every patch. The game probably could have kept more people if it wasn't for that, every time I've come back it's always "wtf is going on now?" Hard to keep even casuals...






2 Oct 2018, 19:29 PM
#85
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053



There's a reason people are hostile towards them. Give advice, do it in a gentle manner. When you go to get a job, the boss doesn't tell you "learn how to work". He TEACHES you. He's there to answer your questions, help you do something a little bit better than you previously did. This is how you teach/advise someone. Does this thing exist in this forum? No, not at all.

I don't degrade Imperial Dane and every Imperial Dane when i say i don't like him. I don't like his attitude, i never questioned his ability as a player. I have watched his streams and i like how he plays (his playstyle as Wehr is what i want to deal with when i play games, not the irritating MG spam i see in my rank). But when he starts the shit about balance, i really wish i could punch him in the face.

Unlike your boss, they have no obligation to you at all and if you go around insulting them, righteously or not, they’re probably not going to have the best/most useful attitude towards you either. I’ve personally only really had positive interactions with top players, probably because I don’t go around bitching that the pros only go around abusing stats or don’t actually know what they’re doing among other things.
2 Oct 2018, 19:41 PM
#86
avatar of Rosbone

Posts: 2098 | Subs: 2

I have said it 1,000,000 times... RNG decides every game. Balance talk is a waste of time.
2 Oct 2018, 19:59 PM
#87
avatar of TheGentlemenTroll

Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1



This is why i don't want to have any kind of advice or conversation with "pros". Everything comes around "learning to play"


I'd hardly call Dane a pro, hes a uber axis bias player that cries foul whenever his opponent bests him, usually not blaming himself or saying his opponent beat him. Say something like "The old OKW KT win button was broken and deserved to be nerfed." and he delivers you a perma ban.
2 Oct 2018, 20:25 PM
#88
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4



I'd hardly call Dane a pro, hes a uber axis bias player that cries foul whenever his opponent bests him, usually not blaming himself or saying his opponent beat him. Say something like "The old OKW KT win button was broken and deserved to be nerfed." and he delivers you a perma ban.


How dare you insult the old the KT!!!111!!!1! USF FANBOI!!!!111!!



2 Oct 2018, 21:13 PM
#89
avatar of TheGentlemenTroll

Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1



How dare you insult the old the KT!!!111!!!1! USF FANBOI!!!!111!!





REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

3 Oct 2018, 03:01 AM
#90
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2



Not a surprise given how many crazy changes the game has gone through. People get sicking of #adapting.

I played COH1 from very early on, I sort of remember one major patch that changed the game pre PE but that was only once, and it was nothing like the constant relearning you have to do with COH2 every patch. The game probably could have kept more people if it wasn't for that, every time I've come back it's always "wtf is going on now?" Hard to keep even casuals...


Not talking about "pros" playing the game, more so of people who were a joy to discuss with. People who contribute to the game, even if just by discussing matters in a constructive way.

Regarding the retention of players, i'll say i have to disagree. Just take a look https://steamcharts.com/app/231430#All

This is the only reason we still have any kind of resemble of support whatsoever after 5 years. ANY game would love to have similar player retention throughout time.

3 Oct 2018, 08:41 AM
#91
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053



Not talking about "pros" playing the game, more so of people who were a joy to discuss with. People who contribute to the game, even if just by discussing matters in a constructive way.

Regarding the retention of players, i'll say i have to disagree. Just take a look https://steamcharts.com/app/231430#All

This is the only reason we still have any kind of resemble of support whatsoever after 5 years. ANY game would love to have similar player retention throughout time.


Wow I wonder what happened in December of last year though. 16,000 peak players lol was DBP really that good?
3 Oct 2018, 10:37 AM
#92
avatar of LeOverlord

Posts: 310


Unlike your boss, they have no obligation to you at all and if you go around insulting them, righteously or not, they’re probably not going to have the best/most useful attitude towards you either. I’ve personally only really had positive interactions with top players, probably because I don’t go around bitching that the pros only go around abusing stats or don’t actually know what they’re doing among other things.


I never went around insulting them, even though i hate their attitude. I really respect and admire D0ggy because when i needed help, he gave me advice and was gentle.
3 Oct 2018, 10:41 AM
#93
avatar of LeOverlord

Posts: 310



I'd hardly call Dane a pro, hes a uber axis bias player that cries foul whenever his opponent bests him, usually not blaming himself or saying his opponent beat him. Say something like "The old OKW KT win button was broken and deserved to be nerfed." and he delivers you a perma ban.


The day i got the ban (was temporary), he started blaming USF's Jacksons and UKF's Fireflies for insane range
4 Oct 2018, 01:47 AM
#94
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053



I never went around insulting them, even though i hate their attitude. I really respect and admire D0ggy because when i needed help, he gave me advice and was gentle.

Seems like an unfair stereotyped view of the pros then, doesn't it?

They don't really have much in common as a group other than their skill level; it's not like they're some sort of tight-knit special interest group or something.
4 Oct 2018, 02:05 AM
#95
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4


Wow I wonder what happened in December of last year though. 16,000 peak players lol was DBP really that good?


Isn't too hard to believe if you understand the core premise of the patch either. DBP was heavily targeting teamgames, most noteably the nerf of the JT/Ele. 4v4 caters to the most players naturally being the more casual gamemode as well as each match consisting of more players. So when a promise is made to make the gamemode that most people play better, naturally more people come back and play the game.
4 Oct 2018, 03:15 AM
#96
avatar of tightrope
Senior Caster Badge
Patrion 39

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 29



Not a surprise given how many crazy changes the game has gone through. People get sicking of #adapting.

I played COH1 from very early on, I sort of remember one major patch that changed the game pre PE but that was only once, and it was nothing like the constant relearning you have to do with COH2 every patch. The game probably could have kept more people if it wasn't for that, every time I've come back it's always "wtf is going on now?" Hard to keep even casuals...


Quite the opposite really, the changes keep the game fresh for the people who play it the most (the pros)

When it comes to requests for help/advice given most of these issues have already been addressed dozens of times and people get burnt out writing the same response over and over again.
4 Oct 2018, 12:43 PM
#97
avatar of LeOverlord

Posts: 310


Seems like an unfair stereotyped view of the pros then, doesn't it?

They don't really have much in common as a group other than their skill level; it's not like they're some sort of tight-knit special interest group or something.


Then i'm wondering why the majority of the community agrees that some pros are totally toxic.
4 Oct 2018, 14:11 PM
#98
avatar of Grim

Posts: 1093



I'd hardly call Dane a pro, hes a uber axis bias player that cries foul whenever his opponent bests him, usually not blaming himself or saying his opponent beat him. Say something like "The old OKW KT win button was broken and deserved to be nerfed." and he delivers you a perma ban.


I'm not really clued up on players and streamers but is he the one with that German accent?
4 Oct 2018, 17:03 PM
#99
avatar of TheGentlemenTroll

Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Oct 2018, 14:11 PMGrim


I'm not really clued up on players and streamers but is he the one with that German accent?


He's Danish, goes by Imperial Dane and has a youtube channel called the Propaganda cast.

4 Oct 2018, 18:22 PM
#100
avatar of Jae For Jett
Senior Strategist Badge

Posts: 1002 | Subs: 2



Then i'm wondering why the majority of the community agrees that some pros are totally toxic.

I would honestly debate that fact. Im glad you avoided using absolutes and kept to things like "majority" and "some," but even then I think you're overestimating. I imagine most people would define pro (for 1v1) as gcs2 level players. Even if you loosened up that definition to include gcs2 qualifier players (so the top 32 seeds from the list), I doubt anyone would really call a noticeable number of these players toxic.

Side note: According to completely subjective personal observations, a lot of people who are "anti-pro" are also pretty toxic (just so you know, im not referring to you with this, Overlord).
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