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Crossroads by WhiteFlashReborn

9 Aug 2017, 18:23 PM
#21
avatar of Luciano

Posts: 712

Uploaded a revised version of Crossroads. Please try it out and post feedback here. The more detailed the better.

Thanks all

Changes: https://imgur.com/a/ok9H0

Map here: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=501836252



Thanks for updating it!
9 Aug 2017, 19:44 PM
#22
avatar of Jae For Jett
Senior Strategist Badge

Posts: 1002 | Subs: 2

I'm a little bit late, and its minor, but the north players cutoff is made more difficult to hold because players can reinforce basically on the point because of how close to the point they can construct (and reinforce from) a base building. Maybe move the north players base territory back slightly if this hasn't already been addressed in your revised version?
9 Aug 2017, 19:52 PM
#23
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

thanks for reminding me of that, i was looking at that months ago in some streams and forgot, ill reanalyze that
10 Aug 2017, 00:55 AM
#24
avatar of ZombiFrancis

Posts: 2742

The green and red cover on the map that was removed never really bothered me, but the map still works just fine without it though.

Moving the burned out house is a good change. VPs seem fine.

I always figured the cutoff house's lack of windows was its weakness. But I don't mind more damaged buildings in the slightest.
10 Aug 2017, 15:26 PM
#25
avatar of Finndeed
Strategist Badge

Posts: 612 | Subs: 1

Looks good! Did you remove 2 strat points as well?
10 Aug 2017, 15:30 PM
#26
avatar of Sturmpanther
Lead Strategist Badge

Posts: 5441 | Subs: 35

Looks good! Did you remove 2 strat points as well?


Its still has 12 hybrid points.

Not sure if Relic will allow to cancle 2 hybridpoints at all. I mean they looked into this map and allowed 12 hybridpoints.

So both side can go faster for light vehicle tech and not only inf spam^^
10 Aug 2017, 16:36 PM
#27
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

Ive gotten mixed ideas on that. Im likely going to leave the 12 strat points unless i see some data or groundbreaking perspective in order to change it.

Reason being, the level of balance that the map is achieving may be driven by unseen variables and i want to change it as little as possible, but still improve it.
10 Aug 2017, 16:46 PM
#28
avatar of 0ld_Shatterhand
Donator 22

Posts: 194

Played a few matches and I have to say, that I really like it. Especially the rework of the northern cutoff is a major improvement. Way more clear and early harassments isn't that easy anymore. Also, the new VP placement feels good.
The only thing, I can think of what you could improve is to reduce the northern base area, so that it ends around the hedgerow, so Ost can't build the T1 near the cutoff anymore. But otherwise great work, it's nice to see, how one of the best 1vs1 maps gets even better.
10 Aug 2017, 16:50 PM
#29
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

Yea im going to look into the base placement, the original intent wasnt to have buildings that close to cutoff, ill let people know when it gets updated tonit, thanks Old_Shatterhand the tests are appreciated, dont suppose you have any replays?
10 Aug 2017, 16:53 PM
#30
avatar of 0ld_Shatterhand
Donator 22

Posts: 194

Yea im going to look into the base placement, the original intent wasnt to have buildings that close to cutoff, ill let people know when it gets updated tonit, thanks Old_Shatterhand the tests are appreciated, dont suppose you have any replays?

Didn´t save the replays. Maybe if I have time, I will play some more and save them for you.
10 Aug 2017, 16:53 PM
#31
avatar of WhiteFlash
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Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

10 Aug 2017, 21:06 PM
#32
avatar of ShadowLinkX37
Director of Moderation Badge

Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4

10 Aug 2017, 22:36 PM
#33
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

10 Aug 2017, 23:31 PM
#34
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

Thanks again for playing, not sure about the cutoff house...im checking it out
10 Aug 2017, 23:41 PM
#35
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

I just tested that house thoroughly, hit it w all kinds of stuff and tried to duplicate the stuck mg, no luck. Its prolly something in COH2. If you can duplicate that bug again to show its map specific let me know def. Otherwise im going to chalk it up to a COH2 bug instead of a map bug. Thanks again for testing and posting a replay gents
11 Aug 2017, 00:40 AM
#36
avatar of LoopDloop

Posts: 3053

I think south has a much better position because of the house ruin, the abundance of green cover on their fuel area (makes being aggressive over there a lot easier than the southeast corner) and the fact that north's only garrison collapses from a sneeze.

Even with those faults, it's probably still one of the maps I think is really balanced.
11 Aug 2017, 09:36 AM
#37
avatar of skemshead

Posts: 610

The changes improve the map, however the side with the house on the cutoff and the timbers stacks is still at a disadvantage. This is due to the wood stacks and the shack acting as shotblockers. The second issue is the house and hedge on the cutoff makes transitioning from left to right more restrictive compared to the other starting position.
11 Aug 2017, 13:33 PM
#38
avatar of zarok47

Posts: 587

Ive gotten mixed ideas on that. Im likely going to leave the 12 strat points unless i see some data or groundbreaking perspective in order to change it.

Reason being, the level of balance that the map is achieving may be driven by unseen variables and i want to change it as little as possible, but still improve it.


This strikes me as odd, why would you need convincing that 12 strat points should be changed, when it really should be "why change the 10 strat points every other map has".

I've listed before why the 12 strat points mess with many balance factors (teching, nades/upgrades and snowballing), and removing 2 strat points on this map is very minor (the strat points near the muni points come to mind).

Basicly, I am asking what groundbreaking perspective there is to keep 12 strat points, how does it improve balance and this map?
11 Aug 2017, 22:04 PM
#39
avatar of WhiteFlash
Senior Mapmaker Badge
Benefactor 119

Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1

A new version was just uploaded

Changes here: https://imgur.com/a/jbQsB

If you havent already subscribe to the map here to play it: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=501836252
12 Aug 2017, 10:54 AM
#40
avatar of Finndeed
Strategist Badge

Posts: 612 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post11 Aug 2017, 13:33 PMzarok47


This strikes me as odd, why would you need convincing that 12 strat points should be changed, when it really should be "why change the 10 strat points every other map has".

I've listed before why the 12 strat points mess with many balance factors (teching, nades/upgrades and snowballing), and removing 2 strat points on this map is very minor (the strat points near the muni points come to mind).

Basicly, I am asking what groundbreaking perspective there is to keep 12 strat points, how does it improve balance and this map?


I have to agree with Zarok.

I think part of the reason OKW got around 85% win rate on this map during GCS was the extra strat points allowed them to get a luchs out even faster and also snowball into a late game where they are virtually unbeatable (at least on paper).

No other faction benefits as much as OKW from increase resource income.

Brits getting the AEC is normally more about conserving manpower.

Ost only get a 222 which isnt exactly OP, or the halftrack which is again not really expensive in terms of fuel or even really in muni. And again manpower is the greater limiting factor in their teching/getting of vehicles.

USF can go for an early Stuart but because its no longer that good against infantry its okay, plus OST and OKW have access to some of the best AT by that stage (Pak 40, raketten, faust, puma and even luchs can be a big problem for the Stuart).

Soviets will always get the T-70 later than the Luchs. Once the luchs is out, their progress towards getting the T-70 out is massively hampered by the luchs, again allowing more time for OKW to snowball.

OKW, on the other hand, can easily build up enough manpower to use the extra fuel to accelerate the luchs acquisition.



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