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Why some Russians hate COH2 [BadComedian]

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2 Aug 2013, 00:14 AM
#61
avatar of Ātman

Posts: 37



As history has shown the Soviet ideology proved to be just as harmful (arguably more) than that of the Nazis.

Some people like to take a modern "progressive" and "politically correct" stance on the subject of East and West but the cold hard facts are that the Soviet Union and all PACT countries were the bad guys and have caused harm to the world that is still felt to this day. Like it or not the East were and continue to be the "bad guys" and no amount of sugar coating and history denial will change that.

The world is a better place without the Soviet Union. The world would have been a better place if the Germans had succeeded in their supposed goal of "racial genocide" (which wasn't the goal) against the Soviet Union.


When discussing about this kind of subject, it's very important to separate governments/dictators from the people.
2 Aug 2013, 00:17 AM
#62
avatar of ThumbsUp

Posts: 182

I watched the whole thing.... somehow. I see his points, but he is really really really dwelling on the negative sides of the game to a point where it has obviously consumed him and making him over emotional. I'm not saying he doesn't have the right to be angry, but I'm sure as shit that if he had waited a few months and thought just a little bit after playing the campaign we wouldn't be getting the same review. If he were to let go of the hate, not be super sarcastic (maybe that's the nature of his videos so nevermind) then maybe he'd be taken more seriously. But in the end, I'm going to contradict his point of saying "it's just a game and it's not meant to hurt anyone". It is a game, adults can handle fictional stories, even if they're based on real events.

This kid wasn't there to see this stuff happen, neither were any of you (if there so happens to be a veteran I apologize although unlikely as it sounds). So honestly, just be open minded, shut up, play the game. If you hate it, just don't play it. If I have a problem with hitting people with cars I don't pop in GTA then rant on youtube how it goes against my opinions of hitting people with cars. Granted WWII was obviously worse than my example, but I'm just trying to make an analogy. I know there's one person out here ready go jump on any comment to defend this guy but to be honest, I think he's immature and a little irrational in this review.
2 Aug 2013, 00:18 AM
#63
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301

Poeple tend to call others sympathizers with a nazi regime, if they dont name them as pure evil every time you talk about WWII. Mainly to shut them down.
I think you misunderstood me. I was naming the strategical reason for the invasion, which was not mentioned yet during the discussion.
Go on bitch´ further

We understood you very well. You ignore facts and try to make other vision of invasion.
2 Aug 2013, 00:18 AM
#64
avatar of Pfuscher

Posts: 183

Aren't the russians overreacting a little bit?
There are about 53947 games/movies/book where programmers/Directors/bookwriters did the same to the germans and I haven't seen them complaining.
2 Aug 2013, 00:20 AM
#65
avatar of Jinseual

Posts: 596

Yeah I think he has a good point when he say the game should focus on heroes and their bravery and not only the negative side. It's like the first coh would focus on rape, Dresden etc, most of the US players would be utterly pissed if it was the case.

And some things are really ridiculous like burning houses with your own people inside for no good reason, or killing soldiers for no good reasons (the cutscene when you win the mission where you save the main character stuck in debris). Someone said it looks like the imperial guard from 40k and I can only agree.


yea, it would be a lot easier for relic to not show bad officers and order 227. even though other video games and movies have portrayed it many times already. even though the soviet union did many unethical things like executing their own troops and german POWs, but since the soviets were fighting a desperate large scale war and many of their own were people dissatisfied with their own government. the things the soviets done were reasonable and it worked. however, relic should probably have ignored all those kind of things and just focus on the battles itself, and not try to make a dramatic story.

they should have made the commander (the one who shot himself in the end) the main character. he was actually pretty cool and would spark less controversy. he even would have made the story more interesting if done right.


about soviet soldiers burning their own civilians. there was an event where the soviets blew up a cave to deny the germans access to their ammo, but there were civilians taking refuge in the cave and the soldiers forgot about them or didn't know about the civilians, thus killing them in the process. so stuff like that did happen but i too would rather have civilians not put into the game.
2 Aug 2013, 00:20 AM
#66
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301

I watched the whole thing....

Yep, you still can't or don't want to get one thing. It's not just a game. It's Relics historical base vision of Western Front.
2 Aug 2013, 00:22 AM
#67
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301

Aren't the russians overreacting a little bit?
There are about 53947 games/movies/book where programmers/Directors/bookwriters did the same to the germans and I haven't seen them complaining.

In that country teach germans=russians?
2 Aug 2013, 00:22 AM
#68
avatar of Cyridius

Posts: 627

My respect for Russians dwindles by the second. They're literally shitting all over themselves saying the actions of their troops in the campaign were not heroic. Fuck me, if defying orders, knowing that you would face severe consequences in order to save your friend isn't heroic, I don't know what is. If trying to fight the system in order to spread the truth of the war and - THESE ARE THE WORDS - the HEROISM OF HIS COMRADES, if that isn't heroic, I don't know what is. If realizing what you did was wrong all along, and then making amends for it where it really mattered isn't heroic, I don't know what is.

You people disgust me. And you should disgust yourselves. You blame Relic for dragging the name of the Russian people through the mud, the only people doing that are YOU. YOU are dismissing the heroism displayed. YOU are ignoring the storyline because you're too stupid to think for yourself. YOU are making it look like the sacrifice of the Russians means nothing.

And by you, I mean Russians. The uneducated beasts that they are. I can't believe there are people out there so mentally deficient that they're devaluing themselves and then blame everybody else. I really can't believe it.

Then again, I don't know why it should be hard to believe. The proof is right here in this thread.


you are right, but still, the americans didnt do any major wracrimes in europe. i mean, hiroshiam and nagasaki were BIG warcrimes, but those are pacific.


The Firebombing of Dresden and the Dachau Massacre say hi.
2 Aug 2013, 00:25 AM
#69
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301



The Firebombing of Dresden and the Dachau Massacre say hi.

You forgot the Eizenhauer death camps for German POWs.
2 Aug 2013, 00:30 AM
#70
avatar of ThumbsUp

Posts: 182


Yep, you still can't or don't want to get one thing. It's not just a game. It's Relics historical base vision of Western Front.


It's a story. I wouldn't take the rape of Nanking and base the entire japanese army around it even if it was just one of many "bad things" shown in a game about the japenese army in WWII.
2 Aug 2013, 00:34 AM
#71
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301


It's a story. I wouldn't take the rape of Nanking and base the entire japanese army around it even if it was just one of many "bad things" shown in a game about the japenese army in WWII.

Oh common? Again that "it's just a game/story" argument? Why there is no such story in CoH1 ? Huh? Why first time i saw "Forgotten Sacrifice" trailer i was inspired by strong charactered bearded russian guy with ushanka and then game come out i get this "just a story"?
2 Aug 2013, 00:36 AM
#72
avatar of Rogers

Posts: 1210 | Subs: 1

I am tired of this absolute crap calling Relic Nazis, and a mouthpiece of Goebbels. He seems oblivious to the Katyan Massacre never happened. Or the fact that the Soviets ignored the plea of Polish resistance fighters during the uprising. The fact so many people agree with him is ludicrous. The treatment of Soviet POWs was inhumane absolutely the Germans received no better from the Russians. "Out of nearly 110,000 German POWS captured in Stalingrad only about 6,000 ever returned home." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Stalingrad All sides committed atrocities that is what happens in war. Both sides showed Heroism and kindness towards civilians, fellow prisoners of war, and soldiers. I am tired of this shitty argument that portrays the Soviet Red Army as some kind of Angelic force from heaven that never committed any crimes. That is far from true.
2 Aug 2013, 00:38 AM
#73
avatar of The_rEd_bEar

Posts: 729

My respect for Russians dwindles by the second. They're literally shitting all over themselves saying the actions of their troops in the campaign were not heroic. Fuck me, if defying orders, knowing that you would face severe consequences in order to save your friend isn't heroic, I don't know what is. If trying to fight the system in order to spread the truth of the war and - THESE ARE THE WORDS - the HEROISM OF HIS COMRADES, if that isn't heroic, I don't know what is. If realizing what you did was wrong all along, and then making amends for it where it really mattered isn't heroic, I don't know what is.

You people disgust me. And you should disgust yourselves. You blame Relic for dragging the name of the Russian people through the mud, the only people doing that are YOU. YOU are dismissing the heroism displayed. YOU are ignoring the storyline because you're too stupid to think for yourself. YOU are making it look like the sacrifice of the Russians means nothing.

And by you, I mean Russians. The uneducated beasts that they are. I can't believe there are people out there so mentally deficient that they're devaluing themselves and then blame everybody else. I really can't believe it.

Then again, I don't know why it should be hard to believe. The proof is right here in this thread.



The Firebombing of Dresden and the Dachau Massacre say hi.



More stupidity, you are just as bad as those "uneducated beast". Please leave.
2 Aug 2013, 00:42 AM
#74
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419

Bad comedian said in the video, that red army did commite crimes aswell. His point was, that soviets are portraied stereotypical and are shown imbalanced, when it comes to atrocities. Also i agree with him, that those things should have been avoided in a game called "company of heroes". It obviously will start a emotional reaction for some people.

At the same time however he is using stereotypes aswell (the use of it he is complaining about in the first place) to blackmail relic as "nazis". I guess not having the same opinion as russians about WWII soviets means being a nazi in their eyes. This one dimensional level of thinking turns down alot of sympathy for his otherwise interesting video.
2 Aug 2013, 00:43 AM
#75
avatar of rubby

Posts: 1

For you Soviet soldiers are just abstractions, but for us they are our relatives, fathers and grandfathers mostly. When you talk with Russian about Red Army in WWII, you actually talk about his parents or grandparents. Every, i repeat, EVERY family in Russia had their lost. It was a total war for us. It was death or freedom and every men took their part in that sacred war. Every russian knows history of western front not only from books, but from their grandfathers stories. I really can't understand why do you think that you are able to know more about our history than us.
2 Aug 2013, 00:43 AM
#76
avatar of ThumbsUp

Posts: 182


Oh common? Again that "it's just a game/story" argument? Why there is no such story in CoH1 ? Huh? Why first time i saw "Forgotten Sacrifice" trailer i was inspired by strong charactered bearded russian guy with ushanka and then game come out i get this "just a story"?


Listen, here is your problem. YOUR interpretation of a game trailer does not equal what the company was trying to accomplish. If they made you feel all patriotic and that you were about to dive into a history lesson then that is YOUR opinion / take on what you were going to receive.

I look at it as a story, you have a problem in the inability to perceive it this way and look at it as some sort of backwards history. I'm from the US, I wouldn't give two shits if I saw a civil war game with cowboys and aliens eating cornbread while the whole country started nuking each other. Is that historically inaccurate? Yes, but I wouldn't go on an internet forum just to smack talk the developers.

They made a game, if I don't like it I will not play it, it's as simple as that. Your Internet warrior attitude will likely not change a single persons perspective on this board. Most of the people who belong to coh2.org belong to this website because they love the game and the series. So my question for you is: WHY are you here? Because from my perspective it seems to just cause trouble. I'm an open minded guy but you've provided me with nothing to go off other than "You just don't get it".
2 Aug 2013, 00:54 AM
#77
avatar of UGBEAR

Posts: 954



Listen, here is your problem. YOUR interpretation of a game trailer does not equal what the company was trying to accomplish. If they made you feel all patriotic and that you were about to dive into a history lesson then that is YOUR opinion / take on what you were going to receive.

I look at it as a story, you have a problem in the inability to perceive it this way and look at it as some sort of backwards history. I'm from the US, I wouldn't give two shits if I saw a civil war game with cowboys and aliens eating cornbread while the whole country started nuking each other. Is that historically inaccurate? Yes, but I wouldn't go on an internet forum just to smack talk the developers.

They made a game, if I don't like it I will not play it, it's as simple as that. Your Internet warrior attitude will likely not change a single persons perspective on this board. Most of the people who belong to coh2.org belong to this website because they love the game and the series. So my question for you is: WHY are you here? Because from my perspective it seems to just cause trouble. I'm an open minded guy but you've provided me with nothing to go off other than "You just don't get it".


but you already pay for it right?
2 Aug 2013, 01:01 AM
#78
avatar of ThumbsUp

Posts: 182

jump backJump back to quoted post2 Aug 2013, 00:54 AMUGBEAR


but you already pay for it right?


Yea but heres the thing, this game is a form of entertainment, and sometimes you pay for things that aren't exactly what you though they were. I've blown 60 bucks on games before and regretted it. It's a gamble we take with new releases. When I make a "mistake" what I do is learn from it, wait for reviews to hit, then make an educated purchase. I don't complain senselessly trying to ruin other peoples time with the game. I'm sure a lot of people really enjoy it. If the game makes me miserable what kind of person am I if I try to drag them down to my misery? If people are mad because they "bought it and hate it" well, they jumped the gun a bit right?
2 Aug 2013, 01:01 AM
#79
avatar of carloff

Posts: 301


Listen, here is your problem. YOUR interpretation of a game trailer does not equal what the company was trying to accomplish. If they made you feel all patriotic and that you were about to dive into a history lesson then that is YOUR opinion / take on what you were going to receive.

So, you think it's all in me? I saw mr.nice guy and want his adventure in full game but Relic didn't do as they show me in trailer? Surelly i can't get you point.


I look at it as a story, you have a problem in the inability to perceive it this way and look at it as some sort of backwards history. I'm from the US, I wouldn't give two shits if I saw a civil war game with cowboys and aliens eating cornbread while the whole country started nuking each other. Is that historically inaccurate? Yes, but I wouldn't go on an internet forum just to smack talk the developers.

I would like to see this "story" if the game would calling Red Alert 4. But suddenly game called "Company of Heroes". What "company" in game are contain "heroes"? I don't live in stereotypes, and don't bother about USA. Hey, are we living in free world or you trying to say about some polite thing on internet? I mean, can we freelly make ours opinions or it's just only "positive feedback" accepted here?


They made a game, if I don't like it I will not play it, it's as simple as that. Your Internet warrior attitude will likely not change a single persons perspective on this board. Most of the people who belong to coh2.org belong to this website because they love the game and the series. So my question for you is: WHY are you here? Because from my perspective it seems to just cause trouble. I'm an open minded guy but you've provided me with nothing to go off other than "You just don't get it".

Yep, and I played that game. And was in game since beta, i was posting about mistakes in map, in russian words and some bugs. And BEFORE the game come out I make a post about "historically inaccurate" my thread was just deleted. Why I'm here? Couse of you guys. Couse of words like this "You really think the main reason why germans invaded was about killing russian population?" http://www.coh2.org/topic/6111/why-russians-hate-company-of-heroes-2-badcomedian/post/60389
It's seems to me, what such a "just a game/story" cousing trouble in my native country. You can check developers blog to see some inspiration they used to build that story. Maybe then you will understand.
2 Aug 2013, 01:24 AM
#80
avatar of Cyridius

Posts: 627




More stupidity, you are just as bad as those "uneducated beast". Please leave.


And not a single rebuttal was heard this day.

I've studied World War II's war crimes for years. I've read source materials, history books, primary source reports, I've seen the pictures, watched the documentaries, I've put a shit tonne of my time into learning about the atrocities of World War II and the years surrounding it.

And the Soviets were second only to the Japanese.

Through the firebombings, the wanton destruction by US forces, the Holocaust and France's all too willing participation, the atomic bombs, the German post war mass murder at the hands of Eisenhower - I've put lots, and lots, and LOTS of time into this.

More time than that dumb piece of shit "BadComedian", more time than you, and more than likely more time than everybody in this fucking thread put together.

If you wanna sit there and tell me that I'm wrong, or stupid, then you better be able to back up your fucking statements. Under Stalin's reign, 60 million Soviets died. That is more than one and a half times the number who died during World War II alone with all the countries combined - excluding those in the Soviet Union.

You wanna sit here and tell me he's the good guy? You want to tell me that an invasion force of 4 million troops managed to kill 23 million people by themselves while fighting pitched battles with an army of 25 million? Yeah, OK, and I shit gold, too.

I bet those 5 million Ukrainian peasants thought Stalin was fucking awesome too, huh?

See, the thing is, I don't hate World War 2 era Russians. They were mostly Conscripts and slaves to the Revolution. Ever hear of the Red Terror? I wouldn't think you have, given the performance of this thread. Turns out our good friend Lenin wasn't exactly the good guy when his first action in power was to silence the media and kill everybody who disagreed with him.

The NKVD was worse than the Gestapo in every conceivable manner. You know Stalin set quotas of how many Russians how to be detained and executed? That he laid out percentage of the population to be culled? That's what the fucking purges were.

I doubt you've heard of the Moscow Show Trials either. Or maybe you did. I bet you think Bucharin's a filthy traitor, too. Yeah, the guy who wrote up the Soviet constitution granting everybody equal rights and freedom was tried and executed of being part of a "Trotskyite Nazi Bloc", nevermind that Leon Trotsky was the original revolutionary who lead the Revolutionary Guard and formed the Red Army to fight the Whites. Soon to end up with an ice pick in the back of his head. I'm sure it was suicide, though.

But let's get back to World War II. Shall we all recount how the Soviets used the German POWs as slave labor in concentration camps, and used them for testing? Such brave men, these Soviets are. Over 50% of the POWs were killed in Soviet camps during the 3 years after the war 1945-1948. That's nearly 2 million people. I bet they were all Nazis though, so who gives a fuck?

Any feeble excuse you can give me is wasted. Any comment you can give me is lies and propaganda. I have the facts. And the facts state the Soviet Union was a larger monster than Nazi Germany ever was.

The Germans didn't fight for victory when they started to lose the war, they fought so they could surrender to the Americans, or preferably the Brits. That 50% figure is from people who made it to the camps in the first place. Most of those who surrendered were killed on sight.

The fact that anybody would deny how disgustingly monstrous the crimes of the Soviet Union are puts them in an identical league to a Holocaust denier or a Japanese man who praises the Rape of Nanjing. That means you. That means that piece of shit BadComedian. That means any of the hundreds of thousands of disgusting people that agree with him.
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