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OKW's early game over-dominance

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3 Apr 2017, 13:26 PM
#1
avatar of DangIT

Posts: 4

I understand that this faction is designed to have an early advantage. You want to dominate me early game, OK, I get it. But why does it have to be at this scale? Please answer the following questions;

  • Why does the kubelwagon cost no fuel?
  • Why is it able to both cap and kill? Why is it mounted with a free LMG34? Isn't %15 faster cap rate alone good enough?
  • Why do sturmpioneers are the starting unit?
  • Why does the best AI light tank in game had it cost reduced? LMFAO, Is this how you nerf the LV rush meta?
  • Why is the Mowing Stuka, the most devastating mobile arty in game, available after 10 minutes? And it costs less than a Calli?




Discuss this like a civilized human, without raging or intolerant behavior.
3 Apr 2017, 13:32 PM
#2
avatar of wongtp

Posts: 598

no mg at t0, indirect weapons come after significant investment into t2.

heavily reliant on aggressive infantry play with can be easily shut down by good mg placement, forcing them into a leig play if fuel is cut off.
3 Apr 2017, 13:37 PM
#3
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 789

Since I don't have the time to explain let me answer with question:
1)Why does the UC cost no Fuel?
2)Why does M3, WC and Bren can carry troops?
3)Why do OKW start with less MP?
4) Why is Luch the only AI light tank?
5) Why does Stuka fire less salvo and dies easier than calliope?
3 Apr 2017, 13:44 PM
#4
avatar of le_saucisson_masque

Posts: 329 | Subs: 2

Why does stuka come with t2 when you got to reach 10cp to unlock calliope ?
Why does calliope is more expensive that stuka ?

This whining discussion could go for ever, that's called balance and each faction has pro & cons.

You got to see the whole thing before saying a faction or even an unit is OP.

But this kind of balance talk can't be done so easily.

If you are really bothered with it, i suggest you to take a closer look at the balance patch being done and the other incoming. The patch maker always want feedback on balance, but it needs to be more constructiv than that
3 Apr 2017, 14:01 PM
#5
avatar of DangIT

Posts: 4

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2017, 13:37 PMVipper
Since I don't have the time to explain let me answer with question:
You respond to questions with answers, not stupid questions.
3 Apr 2017, 14:39 PM
#6
avatar of Taksin02

Posts: 49

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2017, 13:37 PMVipper
Since I don't have the time to explain let me answer with question:
1)Why does the UC cost no Fuel?
2)Why does M3, WC and Bren can carry troops?
3)Why do OKW start with less MP?
4) Why is Luch the only AI light tank?
5) Why does Stuka fire less salvo and dies easier than calliope?



1)To counter kubel spam (UKF didn't have any AT stuff from the begining)
2)- That why it cost 190mp /15 fuel this truck die with 1 faust + some smallarm fire
- It can't use to capture like kubel
3)It start with terminator
4) ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
5) it carry 6 bigass rocket, it can wiped team weapon or destroyed their weapon aslo damage to any vehicle
- the calliope didn't fire everysingle rocket from their tubes

sorry for my bad english
3 Apr 2017, 15:00 PM
#7
avatar of mycalliope

Posts: 635

buddy okw is probably the most handicapped faction right now early game and to an extent midgame
3 Apr 2017, 15:03 PM
#8
avatar of Finndeed
Strategist Badge

Posts: 258

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2017, 13:26 PMDangIT
I understand that this faction is designed to have an early advantage. You want to dominate me early game, OK, I get it. But why does it have to be at this scale? Please answer the following questions;

  • Why does the kubelwagon cost no fuel?
  • Why is it able to both cap and kill? Why is it mounted with a free LMG34? Isn't %15 faster cap rate alone good enough?
  • Why do sturmpioneers are the starting unit?
  • Why does the best AI light tank in game had it cost reduced? LMFAO, Is this how you nerf the LV rush meta?
  • Why is the Mowing Stuka, the most devastating mobile arty in game, available after 10 minutes? And it costs less than a Calli?




Discuss this like a civilized human, without raging or intolerant behavior.


In essence OKW have a very good starting unit, the Sturm pioneers. This is largely the only real advantage they get in the early game and it needs careful micro. Volks are 'okay' they are probably the most average infantry unit at the start of the game.

Remember the Luches got a performance nerf as well.

Normally if a Walking Stuka is out at the 10 minuet mark they have no other tanks. At this point you should have something like a AEC, or a Stuart or a T-70. Make a push and take it out.

The Kubel is good but it isn't OP. If you cant counter the Kubel i suggest you post a replay of one of your games so a staff member can review it and give you some tips.

A couple of questions for you.

Which game mode do you play most?

Which faction do you play most?

Do you play all the factions?

Do you have a set build order, or do you mix it up?

Do you only struggle with OKW?
3 Apr 2017, 21:35 PM
#9
avatar of insaneHoshi

Posts: 156

You sure that they are strong in the early game and not that you suck in the early game?
3 Apr 2017, 21:47 PM
#10
avatar of Xutryn_X7

Posts: 118

Be it 1vs1, 4vs4 i still have problems facing vikers and maxim spam.MG 34 don't supress almost at all rifle blob in yellow crates coming to get you.Maybe you should think to find cover when you see kubel and rebember,if he build 2 kubel and lose them,is like loosing 2 volks squads.They might have an advantage vs USF(if you know how to micro volks and sturms) but vs brits and maxim spam,they are fucked in ieig 18(and one is not enough)
3 Apr 2017, 22:58 PM
#11
avatar of August1996

Posts: 58

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2017, 13:26 PMDangIT
I understand that this faction is designed to have an early advantage. You want to dominate me early game, OK, I get it. But why does it have to be at this scale? Please answer the following questions;

  • Why does the kubelwagon cost no fuel?
  • Why is it able to both cap and kill? Why is it mounted with a free LMG34? Isn't %15 faster cap rate alone good enough?
  • Why do sturmpioneers are the starting unit?
  • Why does the best AI light tank in game had it cost reduced? LMFAO, Is this how you nerf the LV rush meta?
  • Why is the Mowing Stuka, the most devastating mobile arty in game, available after 10 minutes? And it costs less than a Calli?




Discuss this like a civilized human, without raging or intolerant behavior.


Not really, USF & OKW have similiar strength early game relative to the factions they're facing, but I would USF the edge due to Rifles and against OKW Rifles just mow down anything 1v1(except Kubel spam)
4 Apr 2017, 00:22 AM
#12
avatar of Nano

Posts: 102

Sounds like someone who never plays OKW to me.

Kubels are trash, anything kills them and they don't scale into mid or late game at all. I would prefer the old Kubel if possible. I think in Swiss German you literally call a trash can a Kubel.

P2 cannot compete with any other light tank at all and easily killed by any combination of things. It requires very heavy micro to be effective, not to mention skipping med HQ.

Sturmpios are good. They are the only actual bite the OKW has early, losing them is huge, so you have to play smart.

Stuka is unreliable; I have seen those rockets land square on the forehead of a squad and do zero damage, other times I have seen it wipe when it should of done nothing. To get it early is a very large fuel sacrifice and I would only do it if I was forced to (i.e cancer commander or blobs)
4 Apr 2017, 16:42 PM
#13
avatar of Garrett

Posts: 56

I think a big problem in early games (team games that is) is the asymmetry of having to build smth or not. While Soviets and OST lose valuable second before they can go and capture important buildings that often decide the early game (unless you go double pios, which means less combat units), OKW, USF and UKF can just go without having to worry about building something. This usually results in certain buildings being taken by an infantry section or by sturms, which on maps like road to cutoff can be annoying as hell.
Vaz
5 Apr 2017, 07:23 AM
#14
avatar of Vaz

Posts: 806

I'm really not seeing rifles mowing down volks in the early game. It's likely later when the OKW player gets super sloppy and no longer bothers with cover that they get mowed down.

I think a big problem in early games (team games that is) is the asymmetry of having to build smth or not. While Soviets and OST lose valuable second before they can go and capture important buildings that often decide the early game (unless you go double pios, which means less combat units), OKW, USF and UKF can just go without having to worry about building something. This usually results in certain buildings being taken by an infantry section or by sturms, which on maps like road to cutoff can be annoying as hell.


That really shouldn't be a problem, considering the available tools. All of those factions, except UKF have no access to an early MG, so taking the building is just a little stall for grw. On the allied side, it's much more difficult. We now have the short range USF mortar and UKF has nothing until flame upgrade on a UC. If anyone is more well equipped to deal with the situation of not getting their favorite building on the map, it's Ost.
5 Apr 2017, 07:28 AM
#15
avatar of DonnieChan

Posts: 1074 | Subs: 2

what is it with all these balance complaints that spread like mushrooms suddenly?

it feels like 2015 again. Where does it come from?
5 Apr 2017, 10:29 AM
#16
avatar of Hater

Posts: 215

jump backJump back to quoted post3 Apr 2017, 14:01 PMDangIT
You respond to questions with answers, not stupid questions.

Try to answer to them by yourself and you'll have exact the answers to your initial questions. Simple as it is.

Back in time when Kubel was mobile suppression platform - oh shi~
5 Apr 2017, 10:52 AM
#17
avatar of wongtp

Posts: 598

i dont really think okw has a real early dominance, its only when vet compounded with stg upgrades then okw really becomes absurd.

vanilla volks...hmm not so much.
5 Apr 2017, 10:56 AM
#18
avatar of Finndeed
Strategist Badge

Posts: 258

what is it with all these balance complaints that spread like mushrooms suddenly?

it feels like 2015 again. Where does it come from?


Maybe more people are playing the game?

More noobs to infuriate muhahah
5 Apr 2017, 11:15 AM
#19
avatar of Aradan

Posts: 836

OKW is simply faction with no weakness. With a free choice of general, without missing any unit type. In addition to 4-5 star of veterancy.
5 Apr 2017, 11:16 AM
#20
avatar of Iron Emperor

Posts: 1646

They still have to learn to adapt.
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