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russian armor

new AEC is overpowered

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26 Jan 2016, 21:06 PM
#301
avatar of Imagelessbean

Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1

Just correcting terminology. It's not good at "sniping" models as that was not changed in the patch. All it got was an aoe buff/damage. It's value at sniping models remain the same but repeated AOE hits will kill a model. So it probably needs a aoe debuff since it's value was changed to be too high. Probably never noticed the "sniping" before because nobody used it before. Bofors was the preference then but why get a bofors now when you can have aoe on the move?


Absolutely correct. When I used the word sniping I was referring to its ability to hit infantry at max range, not the correct technical term as you pointed out. You are also absolutely correct that this was caused by AoE changes, and that the shell is still missing the infantry unit, it just now can deal damage to it on a miss.

Also comm_ash is correct, the reason this unit was buffed was as a holdover until the Brits can be realigned with other factions early game.

And Dullahan, no I don't think throwing Relic under the bus is correct. They wanted to change OKW, they couldn't do it all at once, and in the meantime Brits were also hamstrung so they needed a bit of work. The intermediate time period does have some teething issues but these will be resolved. The community rightly spotted an issue, Brit snipers could hard counter Ost scout cars, making them to difficult to deal with and forcing sniper v sniper duels. This was altered which left a gap in the Brit tech tree which they are working to fill, but we had a huge winter break in between. Cool your jets, the community is not some big evil beast that always causes problems with the game. We have actually identified multiple issues (aka forcing Soviet faction redesign) and found numerous bugs, and yes, occasionally gotten it wrong, but the good the community does far outweighs the bad.
26 Jan 2016, 21:19 PM
#302
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8



Remove self spotting 50 sight range for normal 35.


And brits become only faction which doesn't have scouting unit while other armies have sometimes two of them.
26 Jan 2016, 21:30 PM
#303
avatar of CookiezNcreem
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 3051 | Subs: 15

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Jan 2016, 21:19 PMKatitof


And brits become only faction which doesn't have scouting unit while other armies have sometimes two of them.

It could be moved to vet 1

And that's Not true. Sections with pyrotechnics and vet 1 cover sight bonus, is almost doubled sight range,(+25) snipers, commander upgrade on tanks, and a bunch of flare based doctrinal abilities,ETC.

26 Jan 2016, 22:08 PM
#304
avatar of Dullahan

Posts: 1383



You only read half of my words. The AEC was buffed because it was a dead end tech unit. It literally did nothing besides counter light tanks (anything weaker than a puma). Once its role was complete, it was useless, because of its buggy vet 1 and inability to kite.


Except it's not and the AEC is perfectly capable of damaging medium tanks. It's no different than the Puma in that regard. It won't 1v1 them, but it's not useless either.

It was also good for harassment: kill base defenses, kill base buildings (med bunkers etc) and caches, which forces your opponent to go deal with it. It was a good command tank vehicle since it had good vision. It was always a very good unit.



And Dullahan, no I don't think throwing Relic under the bus is correct. They wanted to change OKW, they couldn't do it all at once, and in the meantime Brits were also hamstrung so they needed a bit of work. The intermediate time period does have some teething issues but these will be resolved. The community rightly spotted an issue, Brit snipers could hard counter Ost scout cars, making them to difficult to deal with and forcing sniper v sniper duels. This was altered which left a gap in the Brit tech tree which they are working to fill, but we had a huge winter break in between. Cool your jets, the community is not some big evil beast that always causes problems with the game. We have actually identified multiple issues (aka forcing Soviet faction redesign) and found numerous bugs, and yes, occasionally gotten it wrong, but the good the community does far outweighs the bad.


They changed OKW to the communities specifications. Literally word for word one of the stupid threads on here. They weren't half done changing it, they just didn't think anything fucking through. The original design was well thought out, it just wasn't meta. Everyone spams infantry, so when they spammed volksgrenadiers they lost miserably. Oh lets buff volksgrenadiers, ruin the tech structure and yay now spamming volksgrenadiers is viable! Community is happy as can be, but good god is it boring to play now.

Brit sniper soft countered the 222. The stun takes several seconds to wind up, which is more than enough time for the 222 to kill the sniper if it gets close. You just couldn't try and bumrush him from max range when he was ready to stun you, you had to flank. It had nuance. If you brought infantry with your 222 then you could reveal the sniper and shoot him with them to stop him from killing the 222 even.



I enjoyed the game far more when it first came out and the community didn't have a say in anything.
Removing blizzards sucked, fucking with VP pacing sucked, fucking with tech pacing sucked. The community wanted Coh1, and now they've pretty much got it. The Eastern Front was abandoned and the game was slowed way way down.

The game is now an infantry spam fest (4-5 conscripts/riflemen/grenadiers/volks/tommies) followed by shock vehicle (T70/stuart/Luchs/AEC) followed by AT gun grand battery of no micro (both AT guns literally sitting on top of each other) followed by heavy tank call in. And if we're really, really lucky someone will build a machine gun and afk it in a house somewhere.


26 Jan 2016, 22:12 PM
#305
avatar of Zyllen

Posts: 760



You only read half of my words. The AEC was buffed because it was a dead end tech unit. It literally did nothing besides counter light tanks (anything weaker than a puma). Once its role was complete, it was useless, because of its buggy vet 1 and inability to kite.
.


This goes for 90 % of all vehicles you dont see stuarts quads or t-70's after a while or they become support units for mediums tanks.
26 Jan 2016, 22:17 PM
#306
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Jan 2016, 22:12 PMZyllen


This goes for 90 % of all vehicles you dont see stuarts quads or t-70's after a while or a become support units for heavier mediums.


You don't side tech to get stuarts, quads or T-70s.
26 Jan 2016, 22:24 PM
#307
avatar of Vermillion_Hawk

Posts: 140


We have actually identified multiple issues (aka forcing Soviet faction redesign) and found numerous bugs, and yes, occasionally gotten it wrong, but the good the community does far outweighs the bad.


Actually I consider the Soviet redesign in its current state to be a major failure. Nothing has really changed, the Soviets are still heavily reliant on call-ins, it's just now they have a somewhat-useful assault gun in T3 and nobody builds T-34/76s ever, as opposed to occasionally like it was before. Oh and you can't hold out for T-34/85s anymore, so you can instead hold out for an IS-2. Wheeee.
27 Jan 2016, 07:22 AM
#308
avatar of Zyllen

Posts: 760

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Jan 2016, 22:17 PMKatitof


You don't side tech to get stuarts, quads or T-70s.


The price is utterly negligible. and for the usf its nearly impossible to get both the lt and the cpt.
27 Jan 2016, 07:52 AM
#309
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2016, 07:22 AMZyllen


The price is utterly negligible. and for the usf its nearly impossible to get both the lt and the cpt.


Newsflash:

Lt+capt is current meta if you go for pershing or armor company.

And the cost isn't neglibible, unless you're spamming AECs, its one of the most expensive lights in game if not the most expensive one.
27 Jan 2016, 09:16 AM
#310
avatar of Carlos Danger

Posts: 362

I would say the AEC needs to arrive at least twenty fuel later than it does right now. That's still much earlier than a Luchs and just slightly more fuel than is required build a US AA halftrack.

Again, this is the amount of fuel required to build your first light vehicle right now:

AEC: 30+15+50-20=75
Stuart: 60+70-15=115
Luchs: 15+50+65-10=120
T-70: 10+85+70-20=145 (this assuming that the Soviet player goes T1. If they go T2, then it's 155 fuel).
US AA Halftrack: 50+50-15=85

So I'm thinking that the AEC should probably arrive at around the 100-110 fuel mark if rushed. That's still faster than its closest counterpart, the OKW Puma, which arrives at 130 fuel.

My suggestion: AEC cost increased to 60 from 50. Teching cost increased to 25 from 15. And all British Infantry Sections get access to the anti-tank grenade, which is only available to Tank Hunter Sections right now.
27 Jan 2016, 09:23 AM
#311
avatar of Pancake Areolas

Posts: 230

Permanently Banned
The AEC is utterly ridiculous given its timing, due to self spotting, durability, and generalist gun with better than average AT performance. This thing is better than all the light tanks in game and comes way quicker.

Broken as hell. Meta is so not fun. Relic why you never test anything? Ever do a comparison? ffs, the incompetence.
27 Jan 2016, 09:47 AM
#312
avatar of ruzen
Patrion 15

Posts: 243

I do belive AEC and Its timing needs serius balancing but reading some of the suggestions here absolutely unjust.

Be mind that Brits suffer scouting & chasing units. That makes bad retreat mistakes made towards Brits are much more forgiven, just because of that.

Brits allready will recive some buff and bug fixing in 2-3 weeks ( so far we know) and I have no doubt current status will be changing but comparing with other fuel requirements is not the solution. Brits allready has to start relatively defensive with less capping power capabilities. Getting early resource income isnt the strong side of Brits. Also dealing with Panzer 2 or 222.
27 Jan 2016, 12:55 PM
#313
avatar of Captain_Frog

Posts: 248

Remove smoke from the AEC. I honestly have no idea why it has smoke.
27 Jan 2016, 13:02 PM
#314
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8

Remove smoke from the AEC. I honestly have no idea why it has smoke.

Same could be said about okw puma and AAHT.
27 Jan 2016, 13:03 PM
#315
avatar of Glokta

Posts: 61

I would say the AEC needs to arrive at least

My suggestion: AEC cost increased to 60 from 50. Teching cost increased to 25 from 15. And all British Infantry Sections get access to the anti-tank grenade, which is only available to Tank Hunter Sections right now.


@ 440mp / 65 fuel the AEC is prettymuch the most expensive light.

The total costs for the others are not directly compareable as they include access to the rest of the tier rather than just the light. The AEC on the other had is a pure side tech so any increase in cost is "wasted".

By increasing the fuel your double nerfing in cost and timing.

The issue is timing so increase research and build time appropriately.
27 Jan 2016, 13:06 PM
#316
avatar of Captain_Frog

Posts: 248

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2016, 13:02 PMKatitof

Same could be said about okw puma and AAHT.


That signature is gold.
27 Jan 2016, 13:43 PM
#317
avatar of Imagelessbean

Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1


They changed OKW to the communities specifications. Literally word for word one of the stupid threads on here. They weren't half done changing it, they just didn't think anything fucking through. The original design was well thought out, it just wasn't meta. Everyone spams infantry, so when they spammed volksgrenadiers they lost miserably. Oh lets buff volksgrenadiers, ruin the tech structure and yay now spamming volksgrenadiers is viable! Community is happy as can be, but good god is it boring to play now.

Brit sniper soft countered the 222. The stun takes several seconds to wind up, which is more than enough time for the 222 to kill the sniper if it gets close. You just couldn't try and bumrush him from max range when he was ready to stun you, you had to flank. It had nuance. If you brought infantry with your 222 then you could reveal the sniper and shoot him with them to stop him from killing the 222 even.



I enjoyed the game far more when it first came out and the community didn't have a say in anything.
Removing blizzards sucked, fucking with VP pacing sucked, fucking with tech pacing sucked. The community wanted Coh1, and now they've pretty much got it. The Eastern Front was abandoned and the game was slowed way way down.

The game is now an infantry spam fest (4-5 conscripts/riflemen/grenadiers/volks/tommies) followed by shock vehicle (T70/stuart/Luchs/AEC) followed by AT gun grand battery of no micro (both AT guns literally sitting on top of each other) followed by heavy tank call in. And if we're really, really lucky someone will build a machine gun and afk it in a house somewhere.




OKW revamp is incomplete, I hope you understand that. I won't comment further on this.

Brit sniper was able to stop the scout car and a single piat would ruin any attempt you made to flank it. This was completely unfair since the scout car needed time to kill the sniper

Sorry to hear you enjoyed the game more at release, I don't really understand how that is possible since the game was mostly RNG fest at release with heavy cheese (sniper clown cars anyone?). You mention a list of things you preferred, and while there were some people that liked them, the majority greatly disliked them. I still see no need for blizzards, ever.

Your assessment of the game is partially correct, with hyperbole used to spice up and exaggerate your points.

It sounds like COH2 is no longer the game for you. Honestly at the end of the day, I still prefer COH1, but I cannot have that.
27 Jan 2016, 14:58 PM
#318
avatar of whitesky00

Posts: 468

I would say the AEC needs to arrive at least twenty fuel later than it does right now. That's still much earlier than a Luchs and just slightly more fuel than is required build a US AA halftrack.

Again, this is the amount of fuel required to build your first light vehicle right now:

AEC: 30+15+50-20=75
Stuart: 60+70-15=115
Luchs: 15+55+65-10=125
T-70: 10+85+70-20=145 (this assuming that the Soviet player goes T1. If they go T2, then it's 155 fuel).
US AA Halftrack: 50+50-15=85

So I'm thinking that the AEC should probably arrive at around the 100-110 fuel mark if rushed. That's still faster than its closest counterpart, the OKW Puma, which arrives at 130 fuel.

My suggestion: AEC cost increased to 60 from 50. Teching cost increased to 25 from 15. And all British Infantry Sections get access to the anti-tank grenade, which is only available to Tank Hunter Sections right now.


I would rather not put more fuel cost into a side upgrade. Bofors and AEC upgrade cost is the same. changing one would require the other to change as well. timing is a better change.

If you get IS AT grenade, you'll never here the end of the Axis complaints. OP 5 man squad with AT and dual equip = OP. And while you're at it, please fix the AT grenade. I believe all other AT snares do 100 damage but the UKF AT grenade only does 50.
27 Jan 2016, 16:54 PM
#319
avatar of Wehrwietse

Posts: 23

It's ridiculous that ostheer players will have to wait for the february patch.
to be able to play against brits. A decent developer would have hotfixed this issue in a couple of days.
There have already been countless suggestions from the community to fix the issue.
27 Jan 2016, 17:07 PM
#320
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8

It's ridiculous that ostheer players will have to wait for the february patch.
to be able to play against brits. A decent developer would have hotfixed this issue in a couple of days.
There have already been countless suggestions from the community to fix the issue.


You mean like brit players had to wait for 2 months to even be able to compete in ANY game mode?
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