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UKF on Life Support

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8 Dec 2015, 18:01 PM
#181
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5



So you wanted to make a profound and well thought-out observation on how people form strong opinions after playing the most diluted game mode for a very short time and blame their problems on mechanics that wouldn't be problematic had they considered known bugs. But what came out was:

"4v4 ? No one cares."

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't touch 4v4 with a 10 foot pole but I understand the reactions here. If you're going to write that, you have to expect some shit flying your way.


Yes, in hindsight, the low effort of my initial post paid me back ten fold. But eh, everyone got shit off their chest I guess.
8 Dec 2015, 18:11 PM
#182
avatar of Gdot

Posts: 1133 | Subs: 1

The game is balanced on 1s because this is the easiest equation to solve with the least amount of variables; this is a simple solution and is logically sound.


Dusty, you have not played a single game of brit 1v1 since the release of the patch - if anyone is lacking experience on the topic maybe its you?


4s is the most popular game mode. This is the way the game is now - we cater for the majority, not the minority.


All bickering aside, we've lost focus here. Rather than attacking respective game modes we should look for balance in all game modes and as a whole for coh2. We all enjoy this game, we all want balance. Let's get back to business and figure out a remedy to the problem.


I don't think anyone expected this patch to be fluid out of the gate, no matter how much testing was done. Now is the time we work together to make it more balanced for all.


Edit/Addition: A solution for team games could be we use a scaled income nerf. The larger the team the greater the nerf. This could protect 1s balance and could be implemented quite easily.
8 Dec 2015, 18:19 PM
#183
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Dec 2015, 18:11 PMGdot


Dusty, you have not played a single game of brit 1v1 since the release of the patch - if anyone is lacking experience on the topic maybe its you?



I've played about 2 or 3 (I think they were on my stream from a few days ago), but put them away for now until OKW and Brit pop cap bugs get fixed, no point taking easy losses (if there was a way to search against only OST somehow, I'd still queue as them.)

Otherwise, you're right, ideally this game will be balanced for all. Its just incorrect to assume that 4v4 is the priority in balance and that it trickles down which is what some have been arguing here, when 1v1 is and always has been the core of balance with the easiest solutions.

An income scaling solution would probably solve the inherent resourcing issue in 4v4, though I'm not a huge fan of different rules for different game modes.
8 Dec 2015, 18:23 PM
#184
avatar of 5trategos

Posts: 449

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Dec 2015, 18:11 PMGdot

4s is the most popular game mode. This is the way the game is now - we cater for the majority, not the minority.

Catering to the majority is discriminatory. Relic should cater to all its player base while not
discriminating any subset.


jump backJump back to quoted post8 Dec 2015, 18:11 PMGdot

All bickering aside, we've lost focus here. Rather than attacking respective game modes we should look for balance in all game modes and as a whole for coh2. We all enjoy this game, we all want balance. Let's get back to business and figure out a remedy to the problem.


The takeaway earlier was that known pop bugs are a big factor for balance this patch. If we're lucky, we're going to see a hotfix soon addressing those bugs with very minimal balance changes and see how that goes.
8 Dec 2015, 18:31 PM
#185
avatar of Gdot

Posts: 1133 | Subs: 1



I've played about 2 or 3 (I think they were on my stream from a few days ago), but put them away for now until OKW and Brit pop cap bugs get fixed, no point taking easy losses (if there was a way to search against only OST somehow, I'd still queue as them.)

Otherwise, you're right, ideally this game will be balanced for all. Its just incorrect to assume that 4v4 is the priority in balance and that it trickles down which is what some have been arguing here, when 1v1 is and always has been the core of balance with the easiest solutions.

An income scaling solution would probably solve the inherent resourcing issue in 4v4, though I'm not a huge fan of different rules for different game modes.


I'm not either. It could a temporary solution though. Its going to be very difficult to create a singular balance across all game modes, especially when we add new units into the mix quite often (in relation to coh1).
8 Dec 2015, 18:55 PM
#186
avatar of Virtual Boar

Posts: 196

UKF from what I tried so far, is pretty weak sauce VS Axis atm. By the time you have enough fuel for a Centaur to hold the ubermensch blob at bay, they already have panther zerg rush rolling.

GG no re.

Gonna stick to Soviets, they seem to be, right now, the only faction that can really offer some flexibility at all stages of the game, even if this is accomplished by commander dependency. Something Axis never heard off, since their standard issue armies without commanders can pretty much handle any situation. Now try to figure out a way to survive, to maybe, snatch a victory at late game stage. Without some form of allied elite (doctrinal exclusive) infantry or vehicle and you'll earn my respect.
8 Dec 2015, 19:13 PM
#187
avatar of Aladdin

Posts: 959



just STFU about 3v3+ if you don't care for those game modes.


Couldn't have worded that any better! Gold!
8 Dec 2015, 19:28 PM
#190
avatar of Swift

Posts: 2722 | Subs: 1

Invissed two posts, one for flaming and the other for quoting the offending post.

On topic please, I hate to keep reminding everyone.
Hat
8 Dec 2015, 19:30 PM
#191
avatar of Hat

Posts: 166

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Dec 2015, 18:11 PMGdot
The game is balanced on 1s because this is the easiest equation to solve with the least amount of variables; this is a simple solution and is logically sound.


It is not balanced at "1s" though. The balance is horrible because Axis players dominate the discussion.
8 Dec 2015, 19:31 PM
#192
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5

Since Aladdin claimed befote his post was moderated that I am bad and don't know how to play big team games, I present the hardest carry of my life

8 Dec 2015, 19:32 PM
#193
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Dec 2015, 19:30 PMHat


It is not balanced at "1s" though. The balance is horrible because Axis players dominate the discussion.


You only play soviets.

Dear lord.
8 Dec 2015, 19:34 PM
#194
avatar of Bananenheld

Posts: 1533 | Subs: 1

Since Aladdin claimed befote his post was moderated that I am bad and don't know how to play big team games, I present the hardest carry of my life



Well played
8 Dec 2015, 19:35 PM
#195
avatar of WingZero

Posts: 1307

Dusty, you could've saved yourself a whole lot of time and finger cramps if you just said "I misspoke in regards to [no one care] comment".
8 Dec 2015, 19:38 PM
#196
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5

Dusty, you could've saved yourself a whole lot of time and finger cramps if you just said "I misspoke in regards to [no one care] comment".


I did a bit too late for sure.

Though since I couldn't sleep last night, forum shitposting was pretty fun
8 Dec 2015, 19:38 PM
#197
avatar of iTzDusty

Posts: 836 | Subs: 5



Well played


#GotEm
8 Dec 2015, 20:01 PM
#199
avatar of Imagelessbean

Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1

This topic appears to be bash on Dusty, which is stupid. I think he got why his original post made people so upset. The back and forth hit and run stuff is stupid. You don't win discussions you have them.

Can we return to discussion about UKF?
8 Dec 2015, 20:02 PM
#200
avatar of AchtAchter

Posts: 1604 | Subs: 3



Based on what u think 3v3 and 4v4 are fun modes and not competitive modes? It all depends if u wanna play any mode at competitive level on as fun. 3v3 and 4v4 modes and be competitive in u play them at that level, and 1v1, 2v2 modes can be fun modes if u don't care to play them at competitive level

There are players who play 3v3 and 4v4 modes at competitive level, and there are players who play 2v2, 1v1 as fun modes and vice versa


It's not competitive because
1. The maps are not designed in a competitive way.
2. Core game mechanics (map control, positioning, well mixed army force) play less of an role
3. There are not enough "competitive/ good players".

When I played those modes extensively for a 6 month period (stopped about 1-2 months ago) there were hardly any players I'd call good. I consider myself a mediocre 1vs1 / 2vs2 players, yet me and my team were kings in those modes. Holding #1 for axis & allies because most games were over before 15 minutes, I can only recall about 3 deserved losses (all other loses were due drop hack or bugsplat) and those were also only against those teams that hold 1-3 position. Even those players that were top 20 ( I had always elo running) were just bad and checking their playercards often revealed ranks 500+ in 1vs1 & 2vs2.
Again it's not about ranks, its rather about understand and excelling in core game mechanics, those mechanics which are necessary to master when understanding balance.
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