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WEHRMACHT=RUBBISH

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11 Mar 2015, 16:39 PM
#121
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



You know, I had a grandfather once in times of my youth. He used to smoke very much, and my mother told him: 'stop smoking or else you won't see your grandchild adult'. He got extremely scared and stopped smoking immediately.

He died when I was 17.

My mother told me then that I can't smoke cigarettes, not after death of my grandfather, not ever. I was listening her my whole life.

I interrnally regret doing it so much right now. Because your post gave me cancer anyway


I literally just restated what Katitof said so your grief is with him not me, or Relic! Because they are the ones who designed OKW to have 33% less fuel income, and thus tanks for them are 33% more expensive (comparatively):)
11 Mar 2015, 16:41 PM
#122
avatar of Specialka

Posts: 144

He said that if you have 100 and someone else has 66 then you have 33% more, and considering every faction in the game except OKW get's 100 and OKW gets 66, OKW has 66% less than everyone else.

I mean you can argue that everyone has 50% more than OKW, but then you would be an idiot because Relic themselves had said OKW get's 33% reduced fuel income compared to the other factions.


I think you lost yourself into the numbers.

Okw gets 33% less fuel than others factions, that means that others factions get 50% more than them.

But that is still not relevant, since 100 fuel = 100 fuel even for OKW. They just get it slower.
11 Mar 2015, 16:43 PM
#123
avatar of TheSleep3r

Posts: 670



I literally just restated what Katitof said so your grief is with him not me, or Relic! Because they are the ones who designed OKW to have 33% less fuel income, and thus tanks for them are 33% more expensive (comparatively):)


If my grandfather was alive, he would come home, greet everyone heartfully, eat a dinner with whole family, and point out this is a Wehrmacht thread
11 Mar 2015, 17:06 PM
#124
avatar of CookiezNcreem
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 3042 | Subs: 14

The past few pages of this thread





The ostheer panther is expensive,inaccessible for the most part,comes in a useless tier for the most part,is somewhat expensive to replace,it also realistically comes extremely late. Tech costs need to be adjusted accordingly to make this panther more accessible. Right now it sucks and its not fine.


The OkW panther is not as expensive as Ost panther to get if its your first vehicle,but somewhat expensive to replace. The OKW panther also comes earlier,sees less effective competition and counters, and has better support and therefore performs and seems better because OKW can afford to skip tiers without being blasted off the map,unlike ostheer. This Panther is fine.

What are you guys arguing about exactly? I cant bring myself to read and comprehend what started the "10 cheeseburger=/= 66% base grandpa with cancer argument.
11 Mar 2015, 17:09 PM
#125
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

Nothing really, just everyone having the usual morning shout fest.
11 Mar 2015, 19:02 PM
#126
avatar of ALFA

Posts: 6

They should make panther a little bit less expensive(165 fuel for example) but increase it's pop cap so it cannot be spammed(just replaced)
11 Mar 2015, 19:08 PM
#127
avatar of FaustCostBulletin

Posts: 521

Panther is fine, leaning on overpowered for late game in 2v2s.

I'll leave the 1v1 aspect to the enthusiasts.
11 Mar 2015, 19:13 PM
#128
avatar of ALFA

Posts: 6

People say that german tanks can easily destroy soviet tanks.Do this:
1 Hide your tanks on a flank (ex 1 su-85 and 1 t-34/85)
2 attack a little bit away from your hidden tanks(preferably with some vehicles as they are the perfect bait for german tanks)to make tank reinforcements arrive(they come faster than infantry so they won't have infantry support)
3 when the german tanks will attack ,flank them (make sure all your units are shooting at the same vehicle -concentrated fire-)
11 Mar 2015, 19:17 PM
#129
avatar of Glendizzle

Posts: 149

My stats prof in university was famously quoted as saying, "statistics are just another way to lie."

If I have two and you have three... you have 50% more than me. If I have three and you have two.... you have 33% less than me. It's all semantics. Who cares?

Anyway, if they made skipping a tier viable it would vastly improve wehrmacht. You get good units at fair prices, the teching is what kills you. Wehr has trouble on account of four man squads, must reinforce more often, but that's not it. It's the obscene amount of manpower needed to tech up to t4 while usf receives officers for their mp invested in teching.

The biggest issue I have though is field presence due to forward retreat points. Wehr must soft retreat to a halftrack/bunker or go all the way back to the base. On big maps this becomes a problem once your usf opponent can hard retreat and be back in 10-15 seconds. He can apply more constant pressure than you. This also applies to okw vs soviets. It's a distinctly unfair advantage between the vanilla and WFA factions. Between that and the tech structure the wehrmacht is at a huge disadvantage versus the USF.

That said, I prefer the way wehr is designed. They seem to be the most complete faction. They are undisputedly the most capable of using combined arms. That is what I like the most. It pisses me off to no end to have to choose between a suppression platform or an AT gun as usf. As wehr you get the right weapons at the right times. Their light vehicles suck but their armor excels. The team weapons are on average on par or better than their counterparts. I just think the way others tech really hamstrings that faction. At best as soviets you'll have half your stock units available. Usf almost never more than 3/4 and basically the same for okw unless you're going for KT. I think they should make the other factions more like wehr in that sense. It allows for more and better counterplay. They'd have to adjust other stuff of course to adjust for timings.
11 Mar 2015, 19:50 PM
#130
avatar of VonIvan

Posts: 2398 | Subs: 21

It's not rubbish, just a more carefully laid out faction, requiring a bit more skill to use in the early/mid game. Though Pr0stheer does have it's "oh no" moments, it can still tackle the other factions relatively well, especially late game. Though I will admit some units, like the sniper, Panther-T4, T3-P4(Maybe), and PG squad for Pr0stheer need to be re-worked.
Also obligatory post for OP:


Recently, ever since the ninja buff of Pr0struppen, I have found a new way to play Pr0stheer in an entertaining manner without needing to rely on Grens as my main inf unit. :D
11 Mar 2015, 20:04 PM
#131
avatar of Porygon

Posts: 2612

jump backJump back to quoted post11 Mar 2015, 19:50 PMVonIvan
It's not rubbish, just a more carefully laid out faction, requiring a bit more skill to use in the early/mid game. Though Pr0stheer does have it's "oh no" moments, it can still tackle the other factions relatively well, especially late game. Though I will admit some units, like the sniper, Panther-T4, T3-P4(Maybe), and PG squad for Pr0stheer need to be re-worked.
Also obligatory post for OP:


Recently, ever since the ninja buff of Pr0struppen, I have found a new way to play Pr0stheer in an entertaining manner without needing to rely on Grens as my main inf unit. :D


No offence but if you claimed Ostheer being fine, why don't you win some tourney with Ostheer and claim this again? :)
11 Mar 2015, 20:33 PM
#132
avatar of CookiezNcreem
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 3042 | Subs: 14

jump backJump back to quoted post11 Mar 2015, 20:04 PMPorygon


No offence but if you claimed Ostheer being fine, why don't you win some tourney with Ostheer and claim this again? :)



Tourneys are not the only way to play the game. Less than 0.0000000000000000000000000000001 percent of the playerbase is even into tourneys.

People care about team games and 2v2s mostly. 1v1 and competitive is important but its not the end all be all to balance. Buff the ost too much for 1v1 tourney tryhards and all the sudden over half the playerbase we have left is complaining about how OP ostheer is in team games.

Inb4 TEAM GAMES ARE FOR NOOBS AND NO BALANCE IS NEEDED THERE!
11 Mar 2015, 21:26 PM
#133
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 1225




Tourneys are not the only way to play the game. Less than 0.0000000000000000000000000000001 percent of the playerbase is even into tourneys.

People care about team games and 2v2s mostly. 1v1 and competitive is important but its not the end all be all to balance. Buff the ost too much for 1v1 tourney tryhards and all the sudden over half the playerbase we have left is complaining about how OP ostheer is in team games.

Inb4 TEAM GAMES ARE FOR NOOBS AND NO BALANCE IS NEEDED THERE!

Thats not the point, but when it comes to balancing issues, 1v1 should absolutely take priority over any other gamemode. Why? Because it does not only require the most skill, but is actually the easiest to balance - less variables.
The function of tourneys is inter alia to prove stuff, and showcase balance problems. They lend themselves for doing that since you have a condensed sample of solid players competing on fixed maps, producing analyitically meaningful outcomes.
11 Mar 2015, 21:41 PM
#134
avatar of AssaultPlazma

Posts: 300


Thats not the point, but when it comes to balancing issues, 1v1 should absolutely take priority over any other gamemode. Why? Because it does not only require the most skill, but is actually the easiest to balance - less variables.
The function of tourneys is inter alia to prove stuff, and showcase balance problems. They lend themselves for doing that since you have a condensed sample of solid players competing on fixed maps, producing analyitically meaningful outcomes.


Im pretty sure thats exactly what cookie meant, and I 100% agree in that 1v1 should always take priority, but we shouldnt just entirely alienate the rest of the playerbase specially when they far outnumber 1v1 auto match
11 Mar 2015, 23:23 PM
#135
avatar of CookiezNcreem
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 3042 | Subs: 14


Thats not the point, but when it comes to balancing issues, 1v1 should absolutely take priority over any other gamemode. Why? Because it does not only require the most skill, but is actually the easiest to balance - less variables.
The function of tourneys is inter alia to prove stuff, and showcase balance problems. They lend themselves for doing that since you have a condensed sample of solid players competing on fixed maps, producing analyitically meaningful outcomes.



Honestly the game is pretty balanced in all modes outside of the ostheer needing some tweaks early game to compete in 1v1 against USF and to an extent sovs.

5 man grens is just... no... That would destroy what balance we do have.

the MG42 needs a bit more help against blobs(like all MGs)

sniper needs some survival tweaks,221/222 could REALLY use a buff to be a rockhard counter to M20 unless u pop out the crew, flame halftruck could be buffed. Basically make ost T2 a counterpart to USF T2. Idk how they dropped the ball on that so bad.

Tech costs need to be adjusted,and OKW needs to be tuned down. USF could use a tweak in lategame as well. Games pretty balanced at that point,and I think this next patch will be the best CoH2s had. We'll have the new factions finally balanced and some nice stuff to look forward to and speculate. I cant wait. In the meantime can we PLEASE stop suggesting outrageous buffs like 5 man grens.
11 Mar 2015, 23:34 PM
#136
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1




Honestly the game is pretty balanced in all modes outside of the ostheer needing some tweaks early game to compete in 1v1 against USF and to an extent sovs.

5 man grens is just... no... That would destroy what balance we do have.

the MG42 needs a bit more help against blobs(like all MGs)

sniper needs some survival tweaks,221/222 could REALLY use a buff to be a rockhard counter to M20 unless u pop out the crew, flame halftruck could be buffed. Basically make ost T2 a counterpart to USF T2. Idk how they dropped the ball on that so bad.

Tech costs need to be adjusted,and OKW needs to be tuned down. USF could use a tweak in lategame as well. Games pretty balanced at that point,and I think this next patch will be the best CoH2s had. We'll have the new factions finally balanced and some nice stuff to look forward to and speculate. I cant wait. In the meantime can we PLEASE stop suggesting outrageous buffs like 5 man grens.


What about OKW do you think needs being tuned down?
12 Mar 2015, 00:08 AM
#137
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned


What about OKW do you think needs being tuned down?


Stuka

Obers

Shreks

Flaq HQ

Obers

Fussies

Battlegroup radias

Kubel (still blatantly OP vs usf)

Did i mention obers? :snfPeter:
12 Mar 2015, 00:14 AM
#138
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



Stuka

Obers

Shreks

Flaq HQ

Obers

Fussies

Battlegroup radias

Kubel (still blatantly OP vs usf)

Did i mention obers? :snfPeter:


Stuka: Already been nerfed twice, doesn't need any more nerfs unless you want to reduce it's cost (which I assume you don't want to do).

Obers: agreed

Flak HQ: Why should OKW's most important building in the game be defenseless?

Shreks: We have had 3 threads about this, until OKW gets more mobile AT or not shit infantry AT options shreks are going to be a crutch OKW needs

Fussiliers: What the fuck? They have a good flare so they need to be nerfed?

BG HQ: No idea what your grief with the radius is.

Kubel: lol, what is walking left or right while one squad runs down the middle? A good microed kubel in a pain in the butt to deal with but not impossible, I wouldn't care if it was replaced.

Next, please.
12 Mar 2015, 00:15 AM
#139
avatar of AssaultPlazma

Posts: 300



Stuka

Obers

Shreks

Flaq HQ

Obers

Fussies

Battlegroup radias

Kubel (still blatantly OP vs usf)

Did i mention obers? :snfPeter:


yes but you forgot sturmpioneer turbo repair rate....
12 Mar 2015, 00:17 AM
#140
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



yes but you forgot sturmpioneer turbo repair rate....


Why should a 320 MP assault engineer squad have 170 MP repairs?
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