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Sturm pioneers are overpriced

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7 Mar 2015, 04:59 AM
#121
avatar of Nuclear Arbitor
Patrion 28

Posts: 2470

you're probably right but my point is that it's not a big enough issue for me to have seen it. personally, if i'm going to take the time for the batman planning required for mortar smoke i'm probably going to save a tank or smoke out an MG.
10 Mar 2015, 22:46 PM
#122
avatar of pussyking
Donator 11

Posts: 551

Sturmpios are fine as they are. Maybe OP becouse its a PG squad which OKW gets from the getgo and slices thru soviet infantry like a knife thru butter close range.

With well microed kubelwagon it forces SU player to cap somewhere else early game.
19 Mar 2015, 02:41 AM
#123
avatar of Remi

Posts: 17

Personally I would like to see a flamer upgrade, OKW lack any form of building clearance.
19 Mar 2015, 03:45 AM
#124
avatar of AssaultPlazma

Posts: 300

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 02:41 AMRemi
Personally I would like to see a flamer upgrade, OKW lack any form of building clearance.


Have you seen them against units in buildings?
19 Mar 2015, 03:59 AM
#125
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1



Have you seen them against units in buildings?


Yeah, and it's 100% RNG if you kill the squad or not, it's also based on how many windows the building has on each side.
19 Mar 2015, 10:25 AM
#126
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 13678 | Subs: 7

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 02:41 AMRemi
Personally I would like to see a flamer upgrade, OKW lack any form of building clearance.

Except grenades, ISG, Stuka, infiltration nades and AA HT.
Not all factions are supposed to have all the tools.
It just happens that OKW already have most of them anyway.
19 Mar 2015, 10:39 AM
#127
avatar of jeesuspietari

Posts: 168

I would rather not waste infiltration nades to demolish garrisons as their long cooldown period renders me unable to use them when I need them for something else. A price reduction for sturmpios and maybe a flamer upgrade would help okw's struggle against garrisons.
19 Mar 2015, 10:54 AM
#128
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 13678 | Subs: 7

I would rather not waste infiltration nades to demolish garrisons as their long cooldown period renders me unable to use them when I need them for something else. A price reduction for sturmpios and maybe a flamer upgrade would help okw's struggle against garrisons.

If you need oppnent to get out of garrison and never get it back, because it will be demolished, explain to me how is that wasting the cooldown again?

Also what do you suggest for USF then, who have same prblem?
19 Mar 2015, 12:06 PM
#129
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 10:54 AMKatitof

If you need oppnent to get out of garrison and never get it back, because it will be demolished, explain to me how is that wasting the cooldown again?

Also what do you suggest for USF then, who have same prblem?


Not really the same. RE don't have STGs :snfPeter:


Yesterday I picked up flamer with SP. They have finished game with 53 kills :snfPeter:
19 Mar 2015, 12:41 PM
#130
avatar of jeesuspietari

Posts: 168

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 10:54 AMKatitof

If you need oppnent to get out of garrison and never get it back, because it will be demolished, explain to me how is that wasting the cooldown again?

Also what do you suggest for USF then, who have same prblem?


USF does a good job at dislodging garrisons. They can research grenades which double as smoke, the pack howie is good and can lay down white phosphorus incendiary rounds, the AA ht is almost as good as the OKW counterpart. Meanwhile, OKW has this expensive, fragile 4 man sturmpio squad that can essentially cripple their manpower economy if caught in a bad spot or forced to fight garrisons.
19 Mar 2015, 13:33 PM
#131
avatar of Jaigen

Posts: 1130

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 10:54 AMKatitof

If you need oppnent to get out of garrison and never get it back, because it will be demolished, explain to me how is that wasting the cooldown again?

Also what do you suggest for USF then, who have same prblem?


Lol no their nades are rather brutal. and the most popular comander has flame-throwers for base infantry.

Also aa track is building clearing? have you actually used an aa track? because if you did you would know you it doesnt work that way.

While the okw does have building clearing they are either ineffective expensive or doctrine bound.
19 Mar 2015, 13:47 PM
#132
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 13678 | Subs: 7



USF does a good job at dislodging garrisons. They can research grenades which double as smoke, the pack howie is good and can lay down white phosphorus incendiary rounds, the AA ht is almost as good as the OKW counterpart. Meanwhile, OKW has this expensive, fragile 4 man sturmpio squad that can essentially cripple their manpower economy if caught in a bad spot or forced to fight garrisons.

ISG?
AA HT?
Volk nades?

All of what you mentioned for USF have a cheaper, earlier counterpart for OKW already.
If you believe USF options to be good ones, I see absolutely no point in you complaining for OKW then as they got all the weapons needed as well, except much earlier, meaning they'll counter garrisons much faster then USF.

You have solved your own problem and closed yourself the door to further arguing. :clap:
19 Mar 2015, 14:09 PM
#133
avatar of WingZero

Posts: 1364

Not every faction should have the same tools and units, you know like heavy tanks for USF #AsymetricalBalance
19 Mar 2015, 15:23 PM
#134
avatar of Jaigen

Posts: 1130

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 13:47 PMKatitof

ISG?
AA HT?
Volk nades?

All of what you mentioned for USF have a cheaper, earlier counterpart for OKW already.
If you believe USF options to be good ones, I see absolutely no point in you complaining for OKW then as they got all the weapons needed as well, except much earlier, meaning they'll counter garrisons much faster then USF.

You have solved your own problem and closed yourself the door to further arguing. :clap:


LOL the scrub still says aa track and isg.
19 Mar 2015, 15:26 PM
#135
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 15:23 PMJaigen


LOL the scrub still says aa track and isg.


Leave ISG and mortar alone for a while and there are 50% chances that ISG will be more deadly than mortar.



Of course it should be cheaper.
19 Mar 2015, 15:36 PM
#136
avatar of Chiro
Donator 11

Posts: 90

you can't use nades early on as okw because you need a fast schrek and they don't perform the well
isg is expensive as **** and rather useless in my experience
aa ht: inf in buildings should not force you to one strategy

sturmpios work well against houses IF green cover is near by otherwise you just bleed a lot of MP

infiltration grenades are the only tool to really clear houses but only doctrinal - and they are overkill

penal flame-thrower for volks!!!!! (imagine the blob from hell burning everything and blowing tanks up left an right)

i read somewhere that stun-nades are good vs houses maybe if sturms get those at vet 1 ?
19 Mar 2015, 15:48 PM
#137
avatar of Imagelessbean

Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 15:36 PMChiro
you can't use nades early on as okw because you need a fast schrek and they don't perform the well
isg is expensive as **** and rather useless in my experience
aa ht: inf in buildings should not force you to one strategy

sturmpios work well against houses IF green cover is near by otherwise you just bleed a lot of MP

infiltration grenades are the only tool to really clear houses but only doctrinal - and they are overkill

penal flame-thrower for volks!!!!! (imagine the blob from hell burning everything and blowing tanks up left an right)

i read somewhere that stun-nades are good vs houses maybe if sturms get those at vet 1 ?


OK, don't go grenades early then, get the Kubel and make him crawl into every house. Also Shrek does pretty good damage against houses. You can also get a Raken.

ISG is very expensive, but think about getting it on urban maps, it can easily pay for itself.

Sturms are great against units in garrison, and then you remember you are using a faction which can build green cover.

As OKW you are supposed to have a weaker early game since your late game units are so strong.

Also houses don't force you into one start it forces you to consider going for AA ht. You don't have to get it, you can avoid areas with houses on many maps. You can also get a puma and use it. Remember to damage the edges of a house to make it collapse.

OKW are relatively weak to houses, but they get tons of tools to deal with them as the game progresses.

This discussion has also moved to the problems of garrison units for OKW and not Sturms, which are amazing in the right hands.
19 Mar 2015, 15:53 PM
#138
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

The ISG isn't able to damage buildings very much, and it's only effective when used as a direct fire unit when the enemy is in direct LOS, making it very ineffective as a indirect fire unit.

Sturms are good against some houses depending on the window placement as well as who loses more models first, a full 4 model Sturmsquad can normally pull it off if it's lucky, but many times you will just lose a model and then lose the DPS race.

Also houses don't force you into one start it forces you to consider going for AA ht. You don't have to get it, you can avoid areas with houses on many maps. You can also get a puma and use it. Remember to damage the edges of a house to make it collapse.


There are tons of maps were buildings are unavoidable, and the Flak HT damages houses far, far faster than a Puma will, telling a person to get a Puma to counter buildings is insane.

OK, don't go grenades early then, get the Kubel and make him crawl into every house. Also Shrek does pretty good damage against houses. You can also get a Raken.


Shreks barely damage houses at all, as do all forms of infantry based AT thanks to the garrison revamp after WFA.
19 Mar 2015, 15:58 PM
#139
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 13678 | Subs: 7

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Mar 2015, 15:23 PMJaigen


LOL the scrub still says aa track and isg.


YOU

I like where anonymous armchair pros try to insult, its so adorable :crazy:
19 Mar 2015, 16:12 PM
#140
avatar of Jaigen

Posts: 1130



Leave ISG and mortar alone for a while and there are 50% chances that ISG will be more deadly than mortar.



Of course it should be cheaper.



PFF this thing tries to be 2 things at the same time. part aa gun and part mortar and its simply not working. same thing for the su76 btw.
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