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russian armor

Fix Mein Kübelwagen!

24 Sep 2014, 18:31 PM
#82
avatar of broodwarjc

Posts: 824

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Sep 2014, 18:25 PMEsxile


Why do they need an early suppressive platform? 30 muni for 10 or 15 or 20 sec, I'm not a balance expert is a cost for that need. And it's perfect because it's delay shrecks. The same way any upgrade other factions need early game. You want it, you need it, you pay for it and you better use it well because it delay what you could need mid game.


They pay for it with lose of early capping power. Unlike the M3 and WC51 which can cruise around wiping squads and capping at will...:rolleyes:
24 Sep 2014, 18:36 PM
#83
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3600 | Subs: 1



They pay for it with lose of early capping power. Unlike the M3 and WC51 which can cruise around wiping squads and capping at will...:rolleyes:


It doesn't explain why do they need the suppressive ability to be native. You do not fight a M3 or a dodge with the suppression.
24 Sep 2014, 18:38 PM
#84
avatar of MajorBloodnok
Admin Red  Badge
Patrion 314

Posts: 10665 | Subs: 9

Reading through it, this thread has been...varied...(that's being polite).

Colleagues have had to invis at least five posts,and I have just had to invis another.

Please keep it clean, guys. :)
24 Sep 2014, 18:40 PM
#85
avatar of Retaliation
Donator 11

Posts: 97



They pay for it with lose of early capping power. Unlike the M3 and WC51 which can cruise around wiping squads and capping at will...:rolleyes:


You would have a point if OKW actually cared all that much about early capping. It's much more useful to deny the enemy fuel rather than secure your own because of the 66% fuel income from territory. Even munitions are less important because if the enemy has no fuel, he has no vehicles to force schreks.
24 Sep 2014, 18:55 PM
#86
avatar of Enkidu

Posts: 351

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Sep 2014, 18:36 PMEsxile


It doesn't explain why do they need the suppressive ability to be native. You do not fight a M3 or a dodge with the suppression.

It's an issue with Volks being completely pushed off early by rifles. Believe me, I'm very sympathetic to the issues that both USF and soviets have with their infantry right now but sturmpios are too expensive to field enmasse.
I don't think the issue is whether or not the Okw need an early suppression platform (be it Kubel or my-34 ), it's how those units preform. Shrek blobs are annoying but I don't find the okw muni income to be so out of wack that they need a muni dump just to acquire suppression. Early shrieks are often needed for m3s and m20s and a 30muni dump to stop a blob would hurt that a lot.

I'd love to see cons buffed and the Kubel nerfed in some way but I don't think a muni dump is the answer.
24 Sep 2014, 19:05 PM
#87
avatar of wayward516

Posts: 229

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Sep 2014, 18:55 PMEnkidu
I'd love to see cons buffed and the Kubel nerfed in some way but I don't think a muni dump is the answer.


FWIW I agree. I think a decrease in acceleration/turn radius would be a good start. Let it be fast, but ensure that you can't whip it around the battlefield like a coked out chipmunk. Players should be rewarded for flanking the Kubel.

And yes, I'd love to see cons perform better. Their latest nerf didn't make a lot of sense to me.
24 Sep 2014, 19:24 PM
#88
avatar of Enkidu

Posts: 351



FWIW I agree. I think a decrease in acceleration/turn radius would be a good start. Let it be fast, but ensure that you can't whip it around the battlefield like a coked out chipmunk. Players should be rewarded for flanking the Kubel.

And yes, I'd love to see cons perform better. Their latest nerf didn't make a lot of sense to me.

Yeah, I hear you about the cons. It made no sense to me when I read it in the patch notes and makes no sense to me now after using them. Honestly though, I'd rather not see a nerf to the kubel's handling as it behaves like I feel a light vehicle should. I'd much rather see a nerf to it's damage, suppression or setup time.
24 Sep 2014, 19:26 PM
#89
avatar of SexualSalamanca

Posts: 46

I agree with the balance changes proposed by OP. The kubel should function more so as an MG, and not the complete shutdown unit that it currently is. Nothing should be immune to being punished for mistakes.
24 Sep 2014, 19:35 PM
#90
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3600 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Sep 2014, 18:55 PMEnkidu

It's an issue with Volks being completely pushed off early by rifles. Believe me, I'm very sympathetic to the issues that both USF and soviets have with their infantry right now but sturmpios are too expensive to field enmasse.
I don't think the issue is whether or not the Okw need an early suppression platform (be it Kubel or my-34 ), it's how those units preform. Shrek blobs are annoying but I don't find the okw muni income to be so out of wack that they need a muni dump just to acquire suppression. Early shrieks are often needed for m3s and m20s and a 30muni dump to stop a blob would hurt that a lot.

I'd love to see cons buffed and the Kubel nerfed in some way but I don't think a muni dump is the answer.


Well, if you play as USF and you pay your grenades it not likely you'll have enough ammo to pay for Zooks or BARs, If you play Ostheer, you pay your LMG at cost of Shreck, if you play Sov, you pay your AT grenades at cost of molotovs and flamethrowers on your Penals.
If you play OKW you should have free suppression and only pay for your scherks? In all of my 1vs1 games vs OKW that goes farther than a Kubel push, after 10 minutes I'm facing a blob of shrecks + sturmpios before sturmpio squads being replaced by Elite troops when during that time I have no BARs at all because I need that ammo for smoke and dps nades.
BARs and Zooks are crappy today so it's not a big deal, but if they were better the choice would be more important.
24 Sep 2014, 19:57 PM
#91
avatar of Ohme
Honorary Member Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 889 | Subs: 1

I shot at a Kubel yesterday with a Zis, and missed 6 times in a row. It really sucked. My opponent went double Kubel and by that point had a puma. My ZiS was staring at all three while they shot at my teammates captain (who was an AI because he left). The captain couldn't hit them with shreks, and the zis couldn't either. I managed to kill one Kubel.

Bazookas are simply not reasonably effective vs Kubels. They come to late anyway, as the substantial threat from Kubels is the first few minutes of getting shut down.

We should call them Kubeldini, on account of their ability to escape from situations.

Also, as other mods have requested, KEEP IT TOGETHER PEOPLE.
24 Sep 2014, 20:10 PM
#92
avatar of SexualSalamanca

Posts: 46

jump backJump back to quoted post24 Sep 2014, 19:57 PMOhme
I shot at a Kubel yesterday with a Zis, and missed 6 times in a row. It really sucked. My opponent went double Kubel and by that point had a puma. My ZiS was staring at all three while they shot at my teammates captain (who was an AI because he left). The captain couldn't hit them with shreks, and the zis couldn't either. I managed to kill one Kubel.


Same here. Was using Maxim opener for soviets with an early Zis against kubel. Missed like 3 or 4 shots before finally hitting it...and damaging it. Would have gotten away if not for the maxims and engine damage.

The thing probably needs an hp decrease and a target size increase. I know this game isn't meant to be realistic, but a Zis gun would turn a Kubel inside-out. And a crew would not miss a stationary target more than once.
24 Sep 2014, 20:48 PM
#93
avatar of Enkidu

Posts: 351

Look, my favorite faction is USF so I totally understand the frustration with the Kubel and shreks. That being said, I also play every other faction and when I play okw, I never feel like I'm floating munis till late game. You don't get a vehicle snare option and throwing a bunch of volk nades leaves you lacking in shreks. Feeling pressured to spam smokes early is more of a problem with the kubel's performance. I never feel muni starved as soviets even if I'm spamming at nades and mollis. Only time I feel that way is if I'm spamming mines, ppshs and have guards but even then I feel like I have enough to make it work unless I'm base pinned.
Also lol @ kubeldini
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