Panther is under-performing for its cost
Posts: 148
I'll just say that for the fuel it takes to get to tier 4 and then actually produce those units, tier 4 is just too weak. But I want to focus on the Panther. Why would you buff soviet AT, nerf Panther hp, increase the fuel cost and nerf blitz all that the same time? Common sense screams "overkill!". And now playing the patch confirms the Panther and tier 4 are just not worth the cost.
Some changes were needed (I think buffing Soviet AT and changing blitz are a step in the right direction), but the Panther was untenable in 1v1 competitive games and now it's untenable in 1v1 and 2v2 games. It will always come out late and against Soviet combined arms (AT guns and several tanks) and it blows up very quickly when facing the same.
It really needs to be looked at. I suggest buffing back the HP and decreasing the fuel cost again.
"German Tier 4 is not viable in against good players any longer.
Before this patch the panzerwerfer and panther were used frequently -- the Brummbar is a waste of mp and fuel as everyone knows.
Now the Panther was beat to deaf the nerf stick. (1) Increased fuel price, (2) decreased HP and (3) buff Soviet AT all around. One or two of these three changes may have been merited, but doing all three!?! It's over the top and makes the Panther under perform for its cost.
Now the Panzerwerfer takes 90 seconds to reload, up from 54 seconds. The Panzerwerfer without vet was already pretty unreliable in hitting targets in the area -- the rockets are so scattered. Now firing every 90 seconds just makes this a wasted investment. Katyusha rockets didn't need a nerf either. Who was complaining about these units before the patch??
Please keep in mind you already nerfed tier 4 by making it more expensive and longer to get to. Now the Panther has been nerfed in three, possibly more, discrete ways and the Panzerwerfer has been hit hard with the nerf stick too.
Like I said above, some changes were needed, but when you simultaneously buff units and nerf their counters what else do you expect other than imba? Please consider rebalancing German Tier 4 to be more in line with its cost."
Posts: 440
My predictions for next patch? ISU-152 and Elefant will be useless hulks, Lend-Lease will never be used again due to Sherman cost increase + CP increase + stats nerf.
Sound about right?
Posts: 49
I would say everything except the cost increase on the Panther were warranted. I would also argue that with the fundamental change/nerf to blitz (which was absolutely needed) meant the cost increase (on both the panther and blitz) is unnecessary.
Posts: 978
- more fragile (less health and less armor on vet),
- blitz doesn´t work,
- cost is increased,
- and Russian tanks are generally more lethal/ durable
a gun range increase would be cool.
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Now that the Panther is
- more fragile (less health and less armor on vet),
- blitz doesn´t work,
- cost is increased,
- and Russian tanks are generally more lethal/ durable
a gun range increase would be cool.
Its almost as if devs wanted you to use panthers range instead of armor currently.
There is plenty of players who still think its indestructible damage sponge.
Well, its now heavily armored medium tank with range and mobility advantage, time to use these two now that armor is no longer as reliable.
Posts: 1708 | Subs: 2
however it's penetration values on the main gun somehow are 180/170/160 when it should be 260/240/220
Posts: 1637
it's already got 50 range, which is very high for a turreted vehicle, and it's also very fast.
however it's penetration values on the main gun somehow are 180/170/160 when it should be 260/240/220
I think the fuel cost increase was too much. The HP and Armor changes makes it no longer practically invincible. 160 damage a shot from a Zis with its craptasic reload 960 HPs was a bit much. Its also not the only tank to lose HPs this patch.
I personally think that the T4 tech price in general should come down. T3 for cheaper tanks that are weaker. T4 for stronger tanks that are more expensive is what I would like to see. (with the same relative cost)
Posts: 505
I'd also take the Ostwind to T4 in return and seriously buff its AA capabilities so that if the Sov player has an air ability doctrine again, T4 is a decent incentive to play for for the German player.
Posts: 760
Posts: 577
Posts: 66
the Brummbar is a waste of mp and fuel as everyone knows.
obvious troll
Posts: 954
Brumbar needs cost reduction.
But The goddamn T-34/85 double call-in should be single call-in FFS.
Posts: 2779
Seriously for this sky-high cost, getting this panther?
Posts: 1702
It's penetration is supposed to be 240, however right know it is only 170.
Posts: 1571
WAIT FOR THE UPDATE!
it's already got 50 range, which is very high for a turreted vehicle, and it's also very fast.
however it's penetration values on the main gun somehow are 180/170/160 when it should be 260/240/220
Posts: 1439
The difference is it's not damage sponge anymore. It's supposed to be used as hit and run unit.
If you can't utilise your Panthers you're doing it wrong.
Posts: 807
- overexpensive
- to fragile
- nerfed into oblivion
But what you should use in over 1v1 games? P4? hm. Stugs? just lol.
So there is your overnerfed tank, expensive like shit, comming when the battlefield is allready filled with 4-5 T34s. Good luck!
2v2 3v3 multiplayer games seem like 80% loss probability for german faction. Verry balanced indeed.
Posts: 871
Three words for the new panther:
- overexpensive
- to fragile
- nerfed into oblivion
But what you should use in over 1v1 games? P4? hm. Stugs? just lol.
So there is your overnerfed tank, expensive like shit, comming when the battlefield is allready filled with 4-5 T34s. Good luck!
2v2 3v3 multiplayer games seem like 80% loss probability for german faction. Verry balanced indeed.
Could you upload the replay with 4 / 5 T-34s when you have one Panther out. I seem to remember you making various posts about Soviets having to adapt prior to this patch and yet all I have seen you do this patch is whine how bad apparently Germans are.
Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1
Wait for the fix on it's penetration. Unless that's in, all date / opinions are rather useless.
The thread should have ended after this post.
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
I would like to see how it performs at 160 fuel.
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