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Elite Mod Continues - Version 2.2+

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20 Feb 2014, 00:06 AM
#81
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

Don't forget Assault also makes the squad break supression.

Cough
Cough
I suppose what we could do is keep the suppression immunity for the "assaulting" squad, but that would probably mean keeping the obvious flashing ability marker.
20 Feb 2014, 02:23 AM
#82
avatar of VersedHorison

Posts: 21

I think keeping the flashing icon for assault grenades is necessary since there will be a way to tell if grens aren't throwing regular grenades or storms aren't tossing bundle grenades.

On and unrelated note any chance of bazookas being looked at? Probably asking a but much since Infantry doctrine is already pretty strong.
20 Feb 2014, 02:38 AM
#83
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

zooks could use some love yes
20 Feb 2014, 04:01 AM
#84
avatar of Kolaris

Posts: 308 | Subs: 1

It is tricky since Rangers already got a couple buffs, as did OMCG. Maybe a slight Off-Map Artillery nerf? *Not very serious*
20 Feb 2014, 04:05 AM
#85
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Feb 2014, 04:01 AMKolaris
It is tricky since Rangers already got a couple buffs, as did OMCG. Maybe a slight Off-Map Artillery nerf? *Not very serious*


if you mean that veterancy still way to high and that slightly buffed garand version ...
20 Feb 2014, 17:00 PM
#86
avatar of FritzX

Posts: 68

Permanently Banned
the zooks are just not enough accurate vs tanks. they have shity penetration already and if u manage to get behind a tank without getting squashed they just miss their targets at 5 meters away. so, some extra accuracy against tanks wouldn't hurt.
20 Feb 2014, 21:40 PM
#87
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

Well I've always been doubting between increasing their medium range accuracy from 0.6x to 0.75x or reducing their max scatter from 20 to 15.
21 Feb 2014, 00:02 AM
#88
avatar of Kolaris

Posts: 308 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Feb 2014, 04:05 AM12ocky


if you mean that veterancy still way to high and that slightly buffed garand version ...


Well if they don't accomplish anything you think they should be reverted?
21 Feb 2014, 00:55 AM
#89
avatar of Pepsi

Posts: 621 | Subs: 1

I don't like the idea of multiple grenades as we experience it right now because it makes the squad split around and the throws are delayed and you haveno control of the unit during the ability.

So I'd say 1 stunt grenande.

But if you manage to make that when you use the ability all the members throw 1 grenade at the same time in the same direction, that would be great. It would mainly have the exact same purpose of 1 grenade with a better scatter and a better in-game enjoyment.. If you add the butterfly bomb sound to this, you could start a carnival with your volks.
21 Feb 2014, 23:00 PM
#90
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post21 Feb 2014, 00:02 AMKolaris


Well if they don't accomplish anything you think they should be reverted?


No

I think they should be buffed further, (well not sure about garand)
22 Feb 2014, 02:08 AM
#91
avatar of Darc Reaver

Posts: 193

Imo the free bazookas on Rangers are the problem, not necessarily their m1s (although I admit they're quite shitty weapons for a 3cp elite unit) - the zookas haver the tendency to hit their own cover right in front of them, making the squad scatter around without shooting. This also applies to Wehr grens with schrecks btw.

What you could try is following: You could make them more reliable while they're moving. Buff the weapon's moving accuracy and cooldown modifier while on the move. While the squad is moving the zooka guys will not shoot and you won't loose fights because of bazooka scatter shooting. It also fits their role as "breakthrough" infantry more, because they're meant for attacking, at least in my opinion.

I actually did this with Ostheer Sturmfusiliers in 2.100 to avoid the "Schreck effect". They used Kar 98 with dual schrecks and could be upgraded with Mp41 with 75% moving acc. The Kar98 also had 75% moving acc. It worked quite well.

Edit: alternatively you could try to lower the scatter for bazookas slightly to prevent the ridiculous inaccuracy when shooting infantry.
22 Feb 2014, 11:45 AM
#92
avatar of FritzX

Posts: 68

Permanently Banned
Just give the zooks the same accuracy as the RR's, but, the extra accuracy should apply only to tanks. Also, it looks like they have some sort of aim time, because it takes an eternity to shoot sometimes.
22 Feb 2014, 11:59 AM
#93
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

They have the same accuracy, but different scatter levels.

I do believe they have an aim time, need to check but that's something they might need for animations. I thought it was similar to panzerschreck.

I think giving it same accuracy as panzerschrek could work.
22 Feb 2014, 15:47 PM
#94
avatar of FritzX

Posts: 68

Permanently Banned
The only thing i like at coh2 is how those shrecked pzg's are firing their shrecks in the second you pressed halt, without running for cover, or doing drills.
22 Feb 2014, 18:15 PM
#95
avatar of Kolaris

Posts: 308 | Subs: 1

That should be better with the improved Squad AI anyway, but as 12ocky mentioned as long as they have wind-up there's going to be a small delay. We can't do anything about that because of the animation fx.

Lowering the scatter is a good idea imo, but we keep buffing the #1 US doctrine.
22 Feb 2014, 20:57 PM
#96
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

Doesn't change Rangers need some love though ...

Btw what would you guys think of a more reliable ostwind, never burst bugging anymore, BUT with the downside that the reload animation isn't working anymore either?
23 Feb 2014, 04:33 AM
#97
avatar of piwawsky

Posts: 95

more reliable ostwind?! are you kidding me? ostwind is like 5 shots, 5 kills already?! :O
23 Feb 2014, 11:37 AM
#98
avatar of gunther09
Donator 22

Posts: 472

would it hurt to simply consider vCOH balance done for now? looks to me as no real issues are coming up.

Or, a different perspective: vCOH is now 99% done, while in OF there are some real issues open like the staghound.

On the other hand, is there reason to put love into OF until there is a sign from Relic that those changes will be implemented?
23 Feb 2014, 13:25 PM
#99
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

more reliable ostwind?! are you kidding me? ostwind is like 5 shots, 5 kills already?! :O


Yes that happens when u have a burst bug, that issue would be fixed.

But try using it from long range against a rifleman in cover.
23 Feb 2014, 14:54 PM
#100
avatar of Kolaris

Posts: 308 | Subs: 1

would it hurt to simply consider vCOH balance done for now? looks to me as no real issues are coming up.

Or, a different perspective: vCOH is now 99% done, while in OF there are some real issues open like the staghound.

On the other hand, is there reason to put love into OF until there is a sign from Relic that those changes will be implemented?


The problem with OF is you need to make drastic changes and redesigns or all your attempts at balancing are futile. The easiest thing is to simply nerf the obvious OP issues and leave them in an unviable state (in 1v1 anyway), but if that's the case no one will use them in the mod and you may as well have simply left them alone and had a gentleman's agreement to not use them.

We could discuss the more drastic, necessary changes but I wouldn't be optimistic we'd end up doing anything with them.

However I have been thinking we could start to address the ToV units. Before we even get to balance, what do people think about making them extra units rather than replacements? Decisions about what to build should be made in-game, not before it begins. Replacement units (and bulletins) really have no place in a competitive RTS. However I can understand if people would like to keep them disabled just to forget they exist.
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