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High level Knowledge on Balance - tournament

MMX
25 Jan 2022, 03:38 AM
#41
avatar of MMX

Posts: 999 | Subs: 1



Is it even possible to not go both lieutenant and captain in 1v1s?
I mean, you could have the AAHT as a suppression platform, but that is micro intensive and cannot be played aggressively (2 shot dead).
You need the captain for AT gun and you need the lieutenant for the MG, and since you need the MG "sooner" than you need an AT gun, going full tech for both is not all too wise... for what? Laughable pak howi and AAHT?

USF is the same in every mode, which makes it quite fun to play: Maintain aggression or fall to a steady push from axis.


I'd say going Lt into Major is still very viable in 1v1 as long as you maintained decent fuel control/fuel advantage throughout the early game. However, if you lose momentum at some stage it's arguably better to go Cpt before teching to Major as a safety net. Depends on your playstyle as well, early bars or a LV-heavy build would probably require getting an AT gun first. And then there's Airborne, of course...

As for going Cpt first, it's probably the most risky option for the reasons you pointed out already. The AAHT is by no means bad, especially when backed-up by an AT-gun, but going Lt for MGs and Stuart is much safer and easier to recover from potential misplays.
26 Jan 2022, 03:38 AM
#42
avatar of VonIvan

Posts: 2475 | Subs: 21

26 Jan 2022, 04:29 AM
#43
avatar of FelixTHM

Posts: 503 | Subs: 1

That's why everyone goes Airborne. You can go LT-m20-stuart for pressure/aggression, but you get AT guns to fall back upon in case you can't overrun your opponent.

Back-teching to Captain was already made much cheaper than before, so I can kinda stomach the price now, but it's not exactly appetising. Previously the idea of a reinforce cost reduction was floated for USF late-game, similar to Ost T4. Maybe it could kick in when all 3 officers are teched, which is kinda similar to Ost T4.
27 Jan 2022, 07:09 AM
#44
avatar of mrgame2

Posts: 1738

as axis 2v2, how you fight 2 soviets, one going with at penal and other with 7 man cons ppsh? to fast t34/85 mass?
3 Feb 2022, 09:09 AM
#45
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3465 | Subs: 1

It was nice to see Jibber and Incauna trying to play USF in semi-final last week end. Didn't end well for them though.
3 Feb 2022, 12:32 PM
#46
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1051

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2022, 07:09 AMmrgame2
as axis 2v2, how you fight 2 soviets, one going with at penal and other with 7 man cons ppsh? to fast t34/85 mass?


2xMG42s and PTSR Penals are done. 2xPaks and Shit34 is done. Then you rush T4 and build Stupa and Panther.
3 Feb 2022, 21:52 PM
#47
avatar of Katukov

Posts: 702 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2022, 07:09 AMmrgame2
as axis 2v2, how you fight 2 soviets, one going with at penal and other with 7 man cons ppsh? to fast t34/85 mass?

you stop sucking and go x4 lmg grenadier to beat both enemies on a move
4 Feb 2022, 06:00 AM
#48
avatar of TickTack

Posts: 570

Was nice to see okw used to good effect against luvnest Soviets in the qualies
4 Feb 2022, 06:55 AM
#49
avatar of Esxile

Posts: 3465 | Subs: 1

Was nice to see okw used to good effect against luvnest Soviets in the qualies


Yes I´ve seen it after, it was good to see OKW win but Luvnest made a big mistake to allow that.
4 Feb 2022, 11:09 AM
#50
avatar of Nickbn

Posts: 54

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jan 2022, 00:31 AMPorygon
COH2 balance being dead for years, Lelic being too busy for AOE4 and COH3.
Feels like 2012 the abandoned COH1 Faghounds that never would be fixed.


Hey man! checking in again. Hope all is good. I'm great btw.
Friendly reminder - do you have that replay of the MG42 and riflemen? Still curious about that one. Would be good to learn from it.

4 Feb 2022, 11:57 AM
#51
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1051

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Feb 2022, 11:09 AMNickbn


Hey man! checking in again. Hope all is good. I'm great btw.
Friendly reminder - do you have that replay of the MG42 and riflemen? Still curious about that one. Would be good to learn from it.



He is not too wrong though.
4 Feb 2022, 12:32 PM
#52
avatar of Nickbn

Posts: 54



He is not too wrong though.


You mean me or Porygon? If you mean him - can you explain please in what regards you think he's right? Because I find his post saying "COH2 balance being dead for years, Lelic being too busy for AOE4 and COH3.
Feels like 2012 the abandoned COH1 Faghounds that never would be fixed."


doesn't compute or hold any truth in it at all and is just a blatant troll and (imho) sad attempt to stir up the pot.

I don't mind discussion, and I don't mind anyone standing up for his opinion even if it is 100% different from mine, but what I do mind is this short-quick'n'dirty statements that hold no value or add to the discussion at all and just ignore when being legitimately called out. We're not kindergartners anymore. And Judging by porygons post history, it is 99% that.
4 Feb 2022, 17:41 PM
#53
avatar of BasedSecretary

Posts: 1051

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Feb 2022, 12:32 PMNickbn


You mean me or Porygon? If you mean him - can you explain please in what regards you think he's right? Because I find his post saying "COH2 balance being dead for years, Lelic being too busy for AOE4 and COH3.
Feels like 2012 the abandoned COH1 Faghounds that never would be fixed."


doesn't compute or hold any truth in it at all and is just a blatant troll and (imho) sad attempt to stir up the pot.

I don't mind discussion, and I don't mind anyone standing up for his opinion even if it is 100% different from mine, but what I do mind is this short-quick'n'dirty statements that hold no value or add to the discussion at all and just ignore when being legitimately called out. We're not kindergartners anymore. And Judging by porygons post history, it is 99% that.


I meant Porygon. Let me start by saying that if you are looking for a polite exchange of views, internet is not for you sadly. Especially in this forum where the only way to push a message through is to sprinkle it with easy to remember punch lines and other bullshit.

His point stands though. If you consider COH2 to be a balanced game, as in having every unit that performs a specific role correlate in predictable ways against its enemy counterpart, you are simply dead wrong. The evidence for this is plentiful:
  • OKW still cannot build caches, even after devs stripped the faction of its original design which was to lockdown a sector and have fast mobilizing units to advance rapidly.
  • 2/5 factions do not have T0 MG and in the case of OKW, no smoke either to counter MGs.
  • USF and UKF cannot be even slightly competent without specific commanders, due to their idiotic teching structure which requires double teching in order to achieve what stock factions have built in.
  • And so many other things I cannot right now think of.


The thing is, when we are making mention of this glaring unbalances the topic always shifts to "faction design" and "asymmetrical balance", which is not exactly wrong but not exactly right either.

The point is, these glaring inequalities of faction capability and unit capacity will no longer be addressed by Relic due to them releasing AOE4, COH3 and due also to the fact that COH2 is almost 10 years old. If we take for granted that the game will stay this way, it is fair and safe to say that it is glaringly unbalanced.

Does that mean that I will not play it? No.
Does that mean that it is a bad game? No.

It is unbalanced though, which was the original point to make.
6 Feb 2022, 20:05 PM
#54
avatar of Lewka

Posts: 306

Any future patches still planned for CoH2? Besides maybe some bug fixes/optimization


I don't know if it's just getting to my head or I wasn't paying attention, but it feels like over the past couple months CoH2 has been getting small updates here and there. Something feels different
MMX
7 Feb 2022, 05:53 AM
#55
avatar of MMX

Posts: 999 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post6 Feb 2022, 20:05 PMLewka
Any future patches still planned for CoH2? Besides maybe some bug fixes/optimization


I don't know if it's just getting to my head or I wasn't paying attention, but it feels like over the past couple months CoH2 has been getting small updates here and there. Something feels different


While certainly anything is possible, I wouldn't get your hopes up too much tbh. Some of the more closely involved folks have already said that even another hotfix would be highly unlikely at this point, especially with CoH3 rather soon to hit the shelves and binding resources.
And as it stands now there isn't anything desperately calling for a hotfix anyway, so I'd expect this really is the end of the line as far as updates are concerned.
7 Feb 2022, 12:17 PM
#56
avatar of WAAAGH2000

Posts: 712

Just ask any news or plan about new balance patch?Or they give up COH2 because COH3?
12 Feb 2022, 16:55 PM
#57
avatar of TickTack

Posts: 570

europe: 232ms
us-east: 230ms
us-west: 382ms

Knowledge and skill can only take a person so far; and then to be trapped in the sht leagues is no way to prep for tourneys.

Would be interested to hear what proportion of tourney players hail from the southern hemisphere.
18 Feb 2022, 09:37 AM
#58
avatar of Lewka

Posts: 306

jump backJump back to quoted post7 Feb 2022, 05:53 AMMMX


While certainly anything is possible, I wouldn't get your hopes up too much tbh. Some of the more closely involved folks have already said that even another hotfix would be highly unlikely at this point, especially with CoH3 rather soon to hit the shelves and binding resources.
And as it stands now there isn't anything desperately calling for a hotfix anyway, so I'd expect this really is the end of the line as far as updates are concerned.


That's fair honestly
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