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russian armor

Should Osttruppen really be buffed?

30 Apr 2021, 17:58 PM
#21
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1660

I will say, things are being looked at for Ostruppen. At least in yellow cover tests shoot outs - while not always a thing in actual games - they do beat all infantry at long and mid ranges and short-range early game and do decently enough to stall for other supporting units.

We do want to keep them as cheap troops that can stall enemy forces and work well with the MG 42 so they might keep sandbags and/or other items if their early game DPS is dropped so they cannot decisively win vs other infantry at their set ranges.

What I would intend if it was some DPS changes:

Ostruppen vs Conscripts
Truppen win at long-range, around equal at mid and lose up close. This match up, however is mainly focused on positioning and who is in cover first.

Ostruppen vs Conscripts
Defeat Riflemen at long-range, lose at mid and short.

Ostruppen vs Infantry Section
Lose to IS at long-range, loses slightly at mid and wins at short range

I've done some initial testing and reducing their long-range by 10% and their cover bonus from +300% to +250% gets them around somewhere close to the result above when in cover wars.

Now these might all work, but the Ostruppen always have the support of the MG42 and the Truppen are in an army that has more starting MP to account for their T1.


Sorry for the OOT, but I really wanted to ask since every other mainline infantry option for ostheer is being tuned by the update. How does the team feel about VSL Grenadiers with StG44? Is it going to be changed in this patch?
30 Apr 2021, 17:59 PM
#22
avatar of Jilet

Posts: 556

At this point, Osttruppen should be the mainline and Grenadiers should be the elite long range call in unironically. Powercreep of everything else made Grenadiers basically redundant.
30 Apr 2021, 18:00 PM
#23
avatar of jagd wölfe

Posts: 1660

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Apr 2021, 17:59 PMJilet
At this point, Osttruppen should be the mainline and Grenadiers should be the elite long range call in unironically. Powercreep of everything else made Grenadiers basically redundant.

Mg 42 Grenadiers are good tho
30 Apr 2021, 18:08 PM
#24
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

Does someone have several videos/replays of that heavy Osstruppen spam that was circulating a couple of weeks ago?

30 Apr 2021, 18:53 PM
#25
avatar of Jilet

Posts: 556


Mg 42 Grenadiers are good tho


Only if your opponent that is not playing UKF, decides to keep their infantry at 35 range for some reason tho.
30 Apr 2021, 19:42 PM
#26
avatar of leithianz

Posts: 472

Does someone have several videos/replays of that heavy Osstruppen spam that was circulating a couple of weeks ago?



Try this https://www.twitch.tv/videos/994692538?filter=archives&sort=time
But keep it mind that PFC is one of the best players. Slaughtering enemy in auto match is not unusual thing.
30 Apr 2021, 20:04 PM
#27
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6

Does someone have several videos/replays of that heavy Osstruppen spam that was circulating a couple of weeks ago?


Perhaps tomorrow's stats (when April is added to the monthly statistics) will be different, but the automatch stats from March do not indicate any real resurgence of Osttruppen in 1v1. The commander not even in the top 10 most picked. Top 200 players.

Looking at the weekly stats for April, Osttruppen are in the exact same position (11 on popularity).

https://coh2stats.com/stats/month/1614556800/1v1/wermacht?statsSource=top200


I have no interest or stake in Osttruppen as a teamgames player, but based on these and the ML stats I'd say it would probably be best to just revert all the buffs in the preview just to be sure but not nerf them either, and just see how they'll do in the upcoming weeks.
1 May 2021, 08:11 AM
#28
avatar of Willy Pete

Posts: 324

6x LMG42 upgrade plz. High damage output but add a friednly fire chance that to account for the prosttruppen accidentally killing their own buddies witht the spray of bullets. Bound to happen if all 6 of those goobers are carrying lmgs :thumb:
1 May 2021, 10:43 AM
#29
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3



Perhaps tomorrow's stats (when April is added to the monthly statistics) will be different, but the automatch stats from March do not indicate any real resurgence of Osttruppen in 1v1. The commander not even in the top 10 most picked. Top 200 players.

Looking at the weekly stats for April, Osttruppen are in the exact same position (11 on popularity).

https://coh2stats.com/stats/month/1614556800/1v1/wermacht?statsSource=top200


I have no interest or stake in Osttruppen as a teamgames player, but based on these and the ML stats I'd say it would probably be best to just revert all the buffs in the preview just to be sure but not nerf them either, and just see how they'll do in the upcoming weeks.


Stop using popularity as a metric of anything.

Also it’s been a month and still no Osttruppen nerfs in the preview mods. This joke has to end eventually.
1 May 2021, 12:47 PM
#30
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1



Ostruppen vs Conscripts
Truppen win at long-range, around equal at mid and lose up close. This match up, however is mainly focused on positioning and who is in cover first.

Ostruppen vs Conscripts
Defeat Riflemen at long-range, lose at mid and short.

Ostruppen vs Infantry Section
Lose to IS at long-range, loses slightly at mid and wins at short range



How would this be balanced?
1 May 2021, 12:48 PM
#31
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17875 | Subs: 8



Ostruppen vs Riflemen
Defeat Riflemen at long-range, lose at mid and short.



This I find particularly hilarious, given how even grens themselves are balanced to lose to rifles at all ranges, just not as badly at long.
1 May 2021, 13:10 PM
#32
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 1563

1 change that could work but would be controversial is that, make Osttuppen really hardy but very shit at doing damage.
They can't win vs other infantry at any Range but it takes a lot of time to actually kill them.
Maybe increase their Armor from 1 to 1.5 lower their RA from 1.25 to 1.0 and remove their cover based combat bonus. Adjust so they still don't win vs anyone at any range but it takes kind of an unreasonable about of time.
1 May 2021, 13:15 PM
#33
avatar of ZeroZeroNi

Posts: 1563



This I find particularly hilarious, given how even grens themselves are balanced to lose to rifles at all ranges, just not as badly at long.

But I guess this is balanced by the fact grens get lmg's much sooner without any penalties. As bar's/MG hit sooner that long range advantage becomes unimportant very soon.
2 May 2021, 15:57 PM
#34
avatar of Serrith

Posts: 783

RANT WARNING:
When OSTTR was placed in T1 together with grens, IMO OSTTR lost its purpose, Being so similar to Grens.

would prefer if it was buildable in T0 (HQ) together with pio's and MG42's, as i still find its function best as a T1 skip/Gren replacement.


I agree. Though tier 1 should still be encouraged so id recommend locking osttruppen field works(sandbags and barb wire) behind tier 1 as well as CP if osttruppen were put in T0.
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