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[Winter Balance Update] OKW Feedback

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27 Nov 2020, 10:31 AM
#41
avatar of Sander93

Posts: 3164 | Subs: 7

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2020, 10:23 AMVipper
As far as I can remember their where issues with Luch being detected easier when in camo mode.

The detection radius for its camo mode will likely be decreased slightly, but this didn't make it into the first iteration in time. It's not an "issue" as in that it's bugged or unintended but it's currently set at 20 range which is rather high and it makes it somewhat hard to use.


jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2020, 10:23 AMVipper
With changes to penetration remove the bonus damage to emplacements.

Good point, we will test this.
27 Nov 2020, 10:35 AM
#42
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

Also UKF's centaur is locked behind 125 fuel if you include starting fuel. So I am not sure how a doctrinal Ostwind locked behind 135 fuel is crazy gamebreaking OP.

UKF still gets all the needed tools even if rushing T3 ASAP including things that OKW doesn't have like sniper and combat-oriented ultra light vehicle.


UKF has to skip upgrading grenades, infantry weapons and squad size and skip AEC so insanely vulnerable to LVs cuz no sections snare.

Also Scavenge has JLIs and the Ostwind is far better.

No comparison.
27 Nov 2020, 10:56 AM
#43
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 949 | Subs: 1

-Swehrer. All commander vehicles including ostwind\Hetzer\KVs (Shermans and T34\85 are alirght) should requare CPs to be unlocked. There are no rocket since here, the fact that right now commanders put units into roster just by selecting them, bringing hell of a lot more problems that it solves.

Swehrer change is somewhat alright, but without CP requarement on mentioned units, it always will be broken, since playing around with basic army tech and costs, just to ajust specific commanders are a bad idea.

-Give Volks fausts on track call-in and nades on track deployed. Objectively volks dont nessery need flamenades so early, while they do need fausts, because of M3 and Bren carrier.
27 Nov 2020, 11:09 AM
#44
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8


-Give Volks fausts on track call-in and nades on track deployed. Objectively volks dont nessery need flamenades so early, while they do need fausts, because of M3 and Bren carrier.

This is actually SPECIFICALLY why they DO NOT have fausts from get go, so these units can actually be used against them, especially M3 as UC does something from range.
27 Nov 2020, 11:17 AM
#45
avatar of Support Sapper

Posts: 1210

Stumpio have both shreck and sweeper upgradeable is alright, but i will want them have a toggle between deploying each one, so you can only use shreck or sweeper at a time. Like for now spio can put away their sweeper, i think it should be that they need to do so to deploy the shreck.
27 Nov 2020, 11:27 AM
#46
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 949 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2020, 11:09 AMKatitof

This is actually SPECIFICALLY why they DO NOT have fausts from get go, so these units can actually be used against them, especially M3 as UC does something from range.


All this does allows to cheese out usage of this units, because you have no tools to respond aside from raketen which is a suicidal invesment early on, because of map controll against both soviets and UKF.

There are no justification for flame M3 to just retreat wipe and run freely, and for UC to have 0 threat what so ever but small arms fire.

Not to mention Pfusiliers have AT nade from the get go, and this doesnt make OKW suddenly OP and unstoppable by having snare early on.
27 Nov 2020, 11:33 AM
#47
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8



All this does allows to cheese out usage of this units, because you have no tools to respond aside from raketen which is a suicidal invesment early on, because of map controll against both soviets and UKF.

There are no justification for flame M3 to just retreat wipe and run freely, and for UC to have 0 threat what so ever but small arms fire.

Not to mention Pfusiliers have AT nade from the get go, and this doesnt make OKW suddenly OP and unstoppable by having snare early on.

All you have to do to counter this is not spread too thinly, or get early puppchen(that AEC/T-70 later on aren't going to explode on their own anyway).

Its irrelevant what PFs have, this is how doctrines work, you use them to enhance your units or plug some holes. Why do you think Guards were mandatory unit for soviets for 6 years?
27 Nov 2020, 12:02 PM
#48
avatar of BetterDead ThanRed

Posts: 216

since schwere HQ is going from 60 to 90 fuel, does this not mean that obers will be coming out even later than they currently do?

think that may be a scenario that we do not want
27 Nov 2020, 12:05 PM
#49
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17583 | Subs: 8

since schwere HQ is going from 60 to 90 fuel, does this not mean that obers will be coming out even later than they currently do?

think that may be a scenario that we do not want

They will come WITH upgrades.
That means they will be at full potential FASTER then they are now despite hitting the field minute later.
27 Nov 2020, 12:08 PM
#50
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13090 | Subs: 1

since schwere HQ is going from 60 to 90 fuel, does this not mean that obers will be coming out even later than they currently do?

think that may be a scenario that we do not want

It was noticed that not many people build the ober before the upgrade since they are not that good without the upgrades.
27 Nov 2020, 12:26 PM
#51
avatar of BetterDead ThanRed

Posts: 216

quite true

will see how this turns out
27 Nov 2020, 13:27 PM
#52
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 881

Obers were getting deleted by vet II+ LMG infantry by the time they came out in 3v3+. As a rule of thumb these days I assume that I'll be to be forced to retreat a pair 2-3 times before enough vet is attained to go toe-to-toe with a pair of vet II+ mainline lmg squads. And that's from fighting in light cover!

Granted this change might make them rather obnoxious in 1v1s but we'll see.
27 Nov 2020, 14:19 PM
#53
avatar of Smartie

Posts: 838 | Subs: 1

OKW's main problems in the live version are imo:

- onesided match up with UK in the early game
- bad tech, BG not really attractive
- huge timing problems for doctrinal units (Ostwind, Hetzer)

The 1.0 version tackles some of the problems which is good:
- Im happy with the BG changes. It will make the building more attractive.
- Obers, Hetzer and Ostwind can be deployed sooner. Of course testing is needed to see if Hetzer / Ostwind cause problems. Its fair to point out potential problems but I would also like to see that the critics of this decisions come up with viable alternatives. Hetzer / Ostwind are completely irrelevant in the live version,you barely see those units which is a shame.

The current proposals will sadly not help to balance the UK/OKW match up in the early game but this is more about nerfing Brits than buffing OKW imo.


27 Nov 2020, 15:02 PM
#54
avatar of TickTack

Posts: 567

Don't give sturmpios both schrek and sweeper at the same time!

It makes the unit so versatile compared to any other engi squad in the game, plus lets teamgame players get improved repairs and schrekblob capabilities without penalty.

It's just a bad idea ok

Also, why does walking stuka need 60 pen against vehicles, plus an earlier AOE suppression? It's a jack of all trades type of buff and is excessive on an already-strong arty piece.
27 Nov 2020, 15:06 PM
#55
avatar of PatFenis

Posts: 122

No penalty, except massive pop cap bloat and expensive ass models which barely get any survival vet bonuses.
I dont get how people come up with the idea that sturms are these übermenschen which destroy everything after the 5 minute mark.
27 Nov 2020, 15:08 PM
#56
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13090 | Subs: 1

Don't give sturmpios both schrek and sweeper at the same time!

It makes the unit so versatile compared to any other engi squad in the game, plus lets teamgame players get improved repairs and schrekblob capabilities without penalty.

It's just a bad idea ok

You are aware the EFA can equip sweepers and dual AT weapons?
27 Nov 2020, 17:18 PM
#57
avatar of KT610

Posts: 69

Obers were getting deleted by vet II+ LMG infantry by the time they came out in 3v3+. As a rule of thumb these days I assume that I'll be to be forced to retreat a pair 2-3 times before enough vet is attained to go toe-to-toe with a pair of vet II+ mainline lmg squads. And that's from fighting in light cover!

Granted this change might make them rather obnoxious in 1v1s but we'll see.


Obers should be moved to the Command HQ and require 1 deployed truck, but the LMG34 and IR STGS would be locked behind the Schwerer Panzer HQ. This change would give OKW more options for the mid game.
27 Nov 2020, 17:28 PM
#58
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13090 | Subs: 1

Talking about Obers ST44 how about greatly reducing their DPS but increasing the size to 5 men? Squad with low entity number are not very good CQC units.
27 Nov 2020, 18:04 PM
#59
avatar of Mr Carmine

Posts: 1231

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2020, 17:28 PMVipper
Talking about Obers ST44 how about greatly reducing their DPS but increasing the size to 5 men? Squad with low entity number are not very good CQC units.


Dont they ingnore cover with stg,s? Full or nearly full dps despite cover is quite good. And low model cqc squads tend to have excelent nades to win engagements. Bundle nade on stg obers pgrens and jeagers commando's are good examples of this.
27 Nov 2020, 18:18 PM
#60
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 881

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Nov 2020, 17:18 PMKT610


Obers should be moved to the Command HQ and require 1 deployed truck, but the LMG34 and IR STGS would be locked behind the Schwerer Panzer HQ. This change would give OKW more options for the mid game.


Ehh considering how many complaints panzergrens are getting, I don't think that's a good idea...
The T4 placement is fine without overpowering stuff like cons (ober vs vet 0 con :rofl:), but the placement timing I've voiced against many a time (in the live version).
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