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russian armor

Can we plz "fix" the CalliOPe?

20 Sep 2020, 10:23 AM
#1
avatar of dk828315

Posts: 86

No kind of rocket artillery can casually walk up, wipe infantry at minimum barrage range, take a few shots (it can even BOUNCE) and casually reverse back to the rear.
The stuka used to take 2 shots to die then people whined and whined until it's the overpriced squishy thingy it is now, I see similar complaints about the CalliOPe, why isn't it nerfed?
20 Sep 2020, 11:07 AM
#2
avatar of Darkpiatre

Posts: 221

you're calling for problems by wanting to nerf USF
20 Sep 2020, 11:38 AM
#3
avatar of Lady Xenarra

Posts: 265 | Subs: 1

Well he's right on all counts though. Though I suppose it'll end up like the Skill Howie, real changes vetoed at the end of the day apparently. I still cannot fathom the thinking behind keeping a pz iv bouncing off it.
20 Sep 2020, 11:51 AM
#4
avatar of Taksin02

Posts: 143

they could just make it fire like the katyusha so it need stay longer to shoot all the rockets.
(6 rockets 5 times)

walking-stuka can shoot WTFever range, it does the same result. that why it should never has more than 160HP

20 Sep 2020, 11:55 AM
#5
avatar of Darkpiatre

Posts: 221

Well he's right on all counts though. Though I suppose it'll end up like the Skill Howie, real changes vetoed at the end of the day apparently. I still cannot fathom the thinking behind keeping a pz iv bouncing off it.


He may be right, but at the end of the day nothing will change because you can't please everyone, especially those who have a religious faith in their believing. And since the balance team listen to the "community", regardless of their choice they'll be criticize, and you know exactly like everyone which part of this "community" you really don't want to mess with.
20 Sep 2020, 13:18 PM
#6
avatar of BetterDead ThanRed

Posts: 86

All rocket arty has their pros and cons.
-OST deliveres decent dmg and suppression, but has long flighttime
-OKW is accurate and powerful, but long flighttime plus requires skill and luck to be effective in most cases
-SOV is quick to launch, decent damage, but people normally retreat after 1st wave of rockets
-UKF cheap and can often be recrewed, but slow and extra squishy
-USF pros,pros,pros,pros.pros, cons: is a little expensive
20 Sep 2020, 14:29 PM
#7
avatar of dk828315

Posts: 86

This thing is stupid OP in team games, where a player can build 2-3 of them and basically create a no-fun tuning pack for their enemies. My rank is not 4-digit and I know how to micro my infantry to avoid enemies' rocket artillery, but this thing is ridiculous.
Katyusha: fires rockets in volleys of 4 so people can just move their units away when the 1st volley hits, the firing sound is noticeable too.
Land mattress: fires a huge number of rockets but the scatter is also huge.
Panzerwerfer: has a loud firing sound and long rocket flight time.
Stuka: obvious firing sound and the explosive rockets can only be fired in a line, requires lots of skills to hit moving infantry.
CalliOPe: unless you have vision at the moment the enemy deploys his close-range barrage, you are fcked. No window to react.
20 Sep 2020, 15:17 PM
#8
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2178 | Subs: 1

Calliope is indeed ridiculous with its lethality, armour and HP. Not sure how this is considered balanced compared to Panzerwerfer, Stuka, Katjusha and LM?

20 Sep 2020, 15:35 PM
#9
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 8989 | Subs: 1

There is little reason for Calliope to come with dozer upgraded Shermans and rangers.

The unit should simply not be available to the commander.
20 Sep 2020, 15:53 PM
#10
avatar of SkysTheLimit

Posts: 2619 | Subs: 1

Calliope is indeed ridiculous with its lethality, armour and HP. Not sure how this is considered balanced compared to Panzerwerfer, Stuka, Katjusha and LM?


It used to be even stronger and costed 140 fuel. Seems like they just didn't tone it down enough the first time, but the cost originally was supposed to balance it

I honestly wish it were weaker and made stock so I don't have to pick calliope 80% of the time in team games
20 Sep 2020, 16:09 PM
#11
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 207

It was already discussed.
Both Katy\Cali and PFwerfer (less so), are deadly when they are being fired at short range.

One can have 100 rockets per salvo, other can have 10, it doesnt really make any difference, considering that your shit will be most likely wiped before you can even reteat, if enemy shoot from close range.

Problem with Cali is its stupid survivability. It takes 3 shots to die, while it should take 2.
Aswell as its armor, it should give you protection only at long range against mediums. At medium\close range all mediums should have 100% chance of penetration.

All this will still make it distinct from any other arty unit and let it have its survivability, but it wont be THAT hard to kill if played\possitioned bad.
20 Sep 2020, 19:53 PM
#12
avatar of BetterDead ThanRed

Posts: 86

for all its strenghts, its gotta have a major weakness(which of there only are minor ones, if any at all)

maybe let it be immobile for a while before and after firing?
20 Sep 2020, 21:24 PM
#13
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4434

Imo calliope shoulda been side grade for the regular Sherman and cost munitions to fire or some variation of this. Then you manage to get around the call in aspect, and have more metrics to balance it on while also keeping the commanders they are in thirsty. Tweaking health and cost alone isn't sufficient to have the unit unique and balanced for both players.
20 Sep 2020, 22:15 PM
#14
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 207

Tweaking health and cost alone isn't sufficient to have the unit unique and balanced for both players.


Well I dont see macking cali be 2 shot instead of 3 and slightly nerfing it armor, would make it less unique considering that all other rocket arty units die in 1 hit and can be killed even by small arms, let alone LVs.
20 Sep 2020, 23:19 PM
#15
avatar of Grim

Posts: 908

Just make it non doc and give it the same stats/price etc as katyusha.
21 Sep 2020, 00:09 AM
#16
avatar of Zzoner

Posts: 47

Since urban assault is already getting hit hard by RE rifle grenade nerf (Sanders' balance proposal), and tac support has the mediocre strafing run, I would squeeze is riflemen field defenses in both doctrines to protect Calliope from risky flanks with mines and make it 2 shot and always getting penetrated at max range.
21 Sep 2020, 00:50 AM
#17
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4613

Imo calliope shoulda been side grade for the regular Sherman and cost munitions to fire or some variation of this. Then you manage to get around the call in aspect, and have more metrics to balance it on while also keeping the commanders they are in thirsty. Tweaking health and cost alone isn't sufficient to have the unit unique and balanced for both players.


The Calliope should have been a rocket truck like every other faction, but Relic has a soft-spot for CoH1 nostalgia and now we have a rocket tank that nobody knows how to balance.
21 Sep 2020, 01:03 AM
#18
avatar of dk828315

Posts: 86

It was already discussed.
Both Katy\Cali and PFwerfer (less so), are deadly when they are being fired at short range.

One can have 100 rockets per salvo, other can have 10, it doesnt really make any difference, considering that your shit will be most likely wiped before you can even reteat, if enemy shoot from close range.

Problem with Cali is its stupid survivability. It takes 3 shots to die, while it should take 2.
Aswell as its armor, it should give you protection only at long range against mediums. At medium\close range all mediums should have 100% chance of penetration.

All this will still make it distinct from any other arty unit and let it have its survivability, but it wont be THAT hard to kill if played\possitioned bad.

Not quite, the Katyusha's barrage is less frustrating to play against, since it's only 4 rockets that hit you initially, sure it can wipe but not always.
The Panzerwerfer's rockets has long flight time (they even make whistling sound while flying).
21 Sep 2020, 02:43 AM
#19
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4434



The Calliope should have been a rocket truck like every other faction, but Relic has a soft-spot for CoH1 nostalgia and now we have a rocket tank that nobody knows how to balance.

Calliope is a cool unit regardless of coh1 and its unique. Furthermore it's in the game now so instead of bitching that it is we should find a way to make it work and be unique, imo that way should be a munitions cost as it allows the calliope to be strong as it will impact BAR distribution to leverage. Might see some fighting over a munitions point RNGesus willing.
21 Sep 2020, 03:48 AM
#20
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4613

Calliope is a cool unit regardless of coh1 and its unique. Furthermore it's in the game now so instead of bitching that it is we should find a way to make it work and be unique, imo that way should be a munitions cost as it allows the calliope to be strong as it will impact BAR distribution to leverage. Might see some fighting over a munitions point RNGesus willing.


The problem with requiring it to use munitions is when you don't have them, you have a fat ass tank sitting around doing absolutely nothing but occupying popcap and taxing manpower income. I'm against units that require resources to use for that reason.
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