Login

russian armor

State of OKW in the meta

PAGES (13)down
12 Aug 2020, 15:26 PM
#161
avatar of KoRneY

Posts: 373

snip


Jli are great (to me)

Hetzers are... So so.

221/3 is certainly lacking in firepower but has great resource potential but eats pop. So meh / ok?

Opel is great in 4v4.
12 Aug 2020, 16:34 PM
#162
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4443

No aoe heals please no more shitty blob food abilities. Just give them base medics like the soviet at a similar cost. If players want to use the forward retreat they will need to build medics at that truck as well.
12 Aug 2020, 17:40 PM
#163
avatar of GachiGasm

Posts: 215

No aoe heals please no more shitty blob food abilities. Just give them base medics like the soviet at a similar cost. If players want to use the forward retreat they will need to build medics at that truck as well.

Dont you think it will make battlegroup even more useless in 1v1\2v2 if you dont need IGs badly. In 3v3 and on somemakes Battlegroup can give you forward reinforcements, while on some 2v2 and on all 1v1 maps, you can unitilise neither forward reinforcement or retreat point.

Heals from HQ and battlegroup should be different. With battlegroup being supperior.
12 Aug 2020, 21:07 PM
#164
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4443


Dont you think it will make battlegroup even more useless in 1v1\2v2 if you dont need IGs badly. In 3v3 and on somemakes Battlegroup can give you forward reinforcements, while on some 2v2 and on all 1v1 maps, you can unitilise neither forward reinforcement or retreat point.

Heals from HQ and battlegroup should be different. With battlegroup being supperior.

Then make it 2 medics instead of 3 and make it a bit cheaper than soviet medics.
Med truck still has attraction IMO in how fast you can field it, you get your snare up and stgs a bit sooner, could make unlocking it give a discount on stgs or something as well to highlight it as an infantry focused building instead of an armored one.

Regardless of what happens in am absolutely and entirely against AOE heals. It's shit design and rewards blob retreats which should be punished with long heals not rewarded with it taking the same time if it's 1 squad of 6
12 Aug 2020, 21:34 PM
#165
avatar of Klement Pikhtura

Posts: 59

jump backJump back to quoted post11 Aug 2020, 18:01 PMSerrith


1) So rephrase the weakness of USF in this regard. In 1v1s where USF players select a non calliope doctrine, they will not have a rocket artillery barrage if they need it.
SPECIFICALLY arranged teams give you the option of taking soviets as a teammate which does remove this weakness. The weakness being not having the ability to support troops with a rocket barrage.

3) The stats on each unit do not change, but the strategies and tactics do and some units are weaker when utilizing certain strategies then others.

1) USF have Scott which is better then rocket arty in 1v1. Rocket arty is not required in 1v1, unlike teamgames, while having a howitzer on wheels actually comes in handy to deal constant manpower bleed to the enemy.

3) actually good point and is why Brits are borderline op with sections spam in 2v2 early game especially vs OKW, medium armor starts loose value the higher the player count, same with some infantry like cav rifles, ostruppen, assgrens etc. BUT the game will rarely be balanced based on teamgames, cause reasons, regardless how much bigger teamgames player base is compared to 1v1.
17 Aug 2020, 21:06 PM
#166
avatar of achpawel

Posts: 1312

IMO both trucks (mech, battlegroup) should have two tech levels and both should offer the same non mutually exclusive upgrades - medics and repair bots.
MMX
18 Aug 2020, 01:45 AM
#167
avatar of MMX

Posts: 318

IMO both trucks (mech, battlegroup) should have two tech levels and both should offer the same non mutually exclusive upgrades - medics and repair bots.


that would be a surefire recipe to kill even the last incentive to go battlegroup over mechanized.
18 Aug 2020, 04:11 AM
#168
avatar of CODGUY

Posts: 787

I don't play this version of EZ mode very often because it's so boringly simple. But it is funny to see the Axis circle jerk with people complaining that the one faction with every crutch in the book is some how underpowered lol.
18 Aug 2020, 06:45 AM
#169
avatar of KoRneY

Posts: 373

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Aug 2020, 04:11 AMCODGUY
I don't play this version of EZ mode very often because it's so boringly simple. But it is funny to see the Axis circle jerk with people complaining that the one faction with every crutch in the book is some how underpowered lol.


I get the feeling that you don't play very much Axis at all because you're busy losing your pershings to a pg squad
18 Aug 2020, 09:01 AM
#170
avatar of achpawel

Posts: 1312

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Aug 2020, 01:45 AMMMX


that would be a surefire recipe to kill even the last incentive to go battlegroup over mechanized.

True. But I guess it is more about the units it offers than anything else.
18 Aug 2020, 10:22 AM
#171
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4443

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Aug 2020, 06:45 AMKoRneY


I get the feeling that you don't play very much Axis at all because you're busy losing your pershings to a pg squad

Ouch.
25 Aug 2020, 11:41 AM
#172
avatar of Lemethy

Posts: 18

I play mostly OKW in 2v2 with a friend.

Here is my issues:

1. No reliable counter to a sniper early game.
2. The linear techroutes. Its like a gambling for OKW. 50% chance you choose the right path. And you need to choose quick or else you will be late in your build order.
3. No indirect fire options early game. You need to choose a techroute to get this.
4. You rely heavy on your mainline infantry early. And YOU need to put your men behind sandbags or you die. The early mg option has been removed a long time ago why? okw mg is shitty anyways.
5. P4 timing is bad even when you rush it. The timings in general is bad for okw except Stuka and Puma.
6. The King Tiger is overnerfed. The problem with this is that the balance team has removed alot of the strong points with OKW. They had weaker early game but strong lategame. Now its weaker early game and ok late game.
7. The panther is a joke. Its like the gunner is constantly drunk, and you need to press S each time it shall shoot when its a hit and run tank. Its so overnerfed that when i see people try panther rushes I always sigh...

But well some positives about OKW

1. Intresting Tanks, the Jagdpanzer is a good tank in my opinion.
2. Jagdtiger can be a beast in the right hands and with a good teammate.
3. The Flare in spec ops is VERY strong combined with elephant = VERY NICE
4. PFussies is a very good unit when upgraded. THE FLARE IS AWESOME combined with Jagd
5. Obers is obers! :)
25 Aug 2020, 23:09 PM
#173
avatar of Spoof

Posts: 85

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Aug 2020, 11:41 AMLemethy
I play mostly OKW in 2v2 with a friend.

Here is my issues:

1. No reliable counter to a sniper early game.
2. The linear techroutes. Its like a gambling for OKW. 50% chance you choose the right path. And you need to choose quick or else you will be late in your build order.
3. No indirect fire options early game. You need to choose a techroute to get this.
4. You rely heavy on your mainline infantry early. And YOU need to put your men behind sandbags or you die. The early mg option has been removed a long time ago why? okw mg is shitty anyways.
5. P4 timing is bad even when you rush it. The timings in general is bad for okw except Stuka and Puma.
6. The King Tiger is overnerfed. The problem with this is that the balance team has removed alot of the strong points with OKW. They had weaker early game but strong lategame. Now its weaker early game and ok late game.
7. The panther is a joke. Its like the gunner is constantly drunk, and you need to press S each time it shall shoot when its a hit and run tank. Its so overnerfed that when i see people try panther rushes I always sigh...

But well some positives about OKW

1. Intresting Tanks, the Jagdpanzer is a good tank in my opinion.
2. Jagdtiger can be a beast in the right hands and with a good teammate.
3. The Flare in spec ops is VERY strong combined with elephant = VERY NICE
4. PFussies is a very good unit when upgraded. THE FLARE IS AWESOME combined with Jagd
5. Obers is obers! :)

#1 Kubel works very early on, but you need to get lucky. Flak track and Luchs work alright in scaring it away. I don't think snipers are too big of an issue, although maybe Kubel could get a damage buff vs snipers to make it more useful.
#2 That's the way OkW was designed, and I like it this way. You're have limited options, but you're very good at what you have.
#3 Agree, although I think it should be like this.
#4 Agreed. Volks have a short power spike with stgs, but every other point in the game, they are behind. If you lose your vetted volks late game, you have to make obers to replace them, but you also lose your snare. Fusiliers are great, but are awful early game.
#5 Can't say much on this point.
#6 Again, can't say much on this.
#7 Use panzer commanders.
26 Aug 2020, 10:47 AM
#174
avatar of Lemethy

Posts: 18

jump backJump back to quoted post25 Aug 2020, 23:09 PMSpoof

#1 Kubel works very early on, but you need to get lucky. Flak track and Luchs work alright in scaring it away. I don't think snipers are too big of an issue, although maybe Kubel could get a damage buff vs snipers to make it more useful.
#2 That's the way OkW was designed, and I like it this way. You're have limited options, but you're very good at what you have.
#3 Agree, although I think it should be like this.
#4 Agreed. Volks have a short power spike with stgs, but every other point in the game, they are behind. If you lose your vetted volks late game, you have to make obers to replace them, but you also lose your snare. Fusiliers are great, but are awful early game.
#5 Can't say much on this point.
#6 Again, can't say much on this.
#7 Use panzer commanders.


1. The problem is not the Kubel, the problem is that you need to sacrifice 210 manpower for a unit that needs babysitting and that doesnt have anything no dmg, no vision, no impact, I remember when it could pin, that was kinda op. But I think we need to compensate the squishiness with some dps increase against snipers as you said. The luchs puma and flak is all good against sniper. The problem is the very early game, if you face a competent player, the sniper will bleed you and your mainline inf will have an even harder time against their mainline becouse VOLKS is unreliable and rly bad. But I guess its just me.

2. I think the techroute design is aswell. But the problem is the quality of the techroutes, not the design. Bgroup is rly bad, I think we need to have something that replaces the IR Truck. Maybe the hetszer? but nerfed in armor or more expensive? or locked behind an upgrade like the Panzer auth but cheaper.

3. Why? All other factions has tier 0 mortars? Its like when you see an okw go Mortar you instantly know his buildorder.

4. And why no T0 Mg 34? why is that OP? why not look an mg 34 in a commander? or something. Like the old Luftwaffe doctrin.

7. Why does this solve the problem?
26 Aug 2020, 13:47 PM
#175
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4443

What. Trading 210mp to kill 360 is a unit that does nothing? I'm no math mathematician but I'm pretty sure if your kuble kills the sniper then spontaneously combusts immediately after you come out ahead.... Roughly 150mp ahead, which is closer to a whole 'nother kuble than not... And even if it DOESN'T immediately explode, if memory serves it can be repaired for free meaning it wins any bleed trade that it doesn't explode. And even if you are to afraid of your ability to micro it you can still use it to harass points with its speed and cap rate. And even THEN if you are not up to that you can park the kuble NEAR a fight and it'll vet up and get you map hax....
26 Aug 2020, 17:42 PM
#176
avatar of Spoof

Posts: 85

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Aug 2020, 10:47 AMLemethy


1. The problem is not the Kubel, the problem is that you need to sacrifice 210 manpower for a unit that needs babysitting and that doesnt have anything no dmg, no vision, no impact, I remember when it could pin, that was kinda op. But I think we need to compensate the squishiness with some dps increase against snipers as you said. The luchs puma and flak is all good against sniper. The problem is the very early game, if you face a competent player, the sniper will bleed you and your mainline inf will have an even harder time against their mainline becouse VOLKS is unreliable and rly bad. But I guess its just me.

2. I think the techroute design is aswell. But the problem is the quality of the techroutes, not the design. Bgroup is rly bad, I think we need to have something that replaces the IR Truck. Maybe the hetszer? but nerfed in armor or more expensive? or locked behind an upgrade like the Panzer auth but cheaper.

3. Why? All other factions has tier 0 mortars? Its like when you see an okw go Mortar you instantly know his buildorder.

4. And why no T0 Mg 34? why is that OP? why not look an mg 34 in a commander? or something. Like the old Luftwaffe doctrin.

7. Why does this solve the problem?

1. I agree with thedarkarmadillo on this one. Kubel is dirt cheap. At least it can force the sniper away. It also won't cause any manpower bleed. If you can get it to vet 1, it can really help trying to find that sniper.
2. I agree, battlegroup just isn't very appealing when you can get mech, which is much safer.
3. Brits don't have T0 mortar. The problem isn't with the leig timing, the problem is that volks are underwhelming. Generally, I don't have a problem with MG spam or garrisons (except in big team games).
4. Well, what are you going to replace the MG34 with? Also, OkW is supposed to have weak support teams. Rak at least comes out early. Both the leig and the MG34 are pretty bad and come out late.
7. +10 sight, +10% accuracy. Works wonders when hunting tanks. Moving accuracy is a little better, and it almost never misses when stopped.
26 Aug 2020, 19:21 PM
#177
avatar of Serrith

Posts: 583

What. Trading 210mp to kill 360 is a unit that does nothing? I'm no math mathematician but I'm pretty sure if your kuble kills the sniper then spontaneously combusts immediately after you come out ahead.... Roughly 150mp ahead, which is closer to a whole 'nother kuble than not... And even if it DOESN'T immediately explode, if memory serves it can be repaired for free meaning it wins any bleed trade that it doesn't explode. And even if you are to afraid of your ability to micro it you can still use it to harass points with its speed and cap rate. And even THEN if you are not up to that you can park the kuble NEAR a fight and it'll vet up and get you map hax....


Its more trading 210mp for a chance to knock out 360mp.
26 Aug 2020, 19:38 PM
#178
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4443

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Aug 2020, 19:21 PMSerrith


Its more trading 210mp for a chance to knock out 360mp.

That's about as good a trade ratio as you can get in coh2 frankly
26 Aug 2020, 20:27 PM
#179
avatar of Serrith

Posts: 583


That's about as good a trade ratio as you can get in coh2 frankly


Its a good trade ratio under the assumption it's successful, but there's the question of how likely is it to succeed.

Another example of a dive might be diving a USF base with a panzer 4 to snipe the ambo. You are potentially trading 120 fuel for 10 fuel, but the risk associated is much lower because the panzer 4 only needs to get one shot off, is far more durable then the kubel and that you know exactly where the ambo is at basically all times.
26 Aug 2020, 22:40 PM
#180
avatar of thedarkarmadillo

Posts: 4443

jump backJump back to quoted post26 Aug 2020, 20:27 PMSerrith


Its a good trade ratio under the assumption it's successful, but there's the question of how likely is it to succeed.

Another example of a dive might be diving a USF base with a panzer 4 to snipe the ambo. You are potentially trading 120 fuel for 10 fuel, but the risk associated is much lower because the panzer 4 only needs to get one shot off, is far more durable then the kubel and that you know exactly where the ambo is at basically all times.

Even if it doesn't KILL the sniper it's going to tie up more resources than it costs defending the sniper. 210mp to make a 360mp unit take more care is a solid investment considering how much else it can do. If it got much better at sniping and he sniper it would need a cost increase, especially since both allied snipers require a bit of tech to field.
PAGES (13)down
1 user is browsing this thread: 1 guest
ML3: Finals Weekend

Ladders Top 10

  • #
    Steam Alias
    W
    L
    %
    Streak
Data provided by Relic Relic Entertainment

Replay highlight

VS
  • Ostheer flag T.R. FIRE AND TERROR
  • Soviets flag B-Sky-IIRevolutionII
uploaded by B-Sky-IIRevolutionII

Board Info

228 users are online: 6 members and 222 guests
knox85, Fire and Terror, SneakEye, M3g4s34n, AtomicRockets, Khan
60 posts in the last 24h
671 posts in the last week
2221 posts in the last month
Registered members: 22632
Welcome our newest member, kathyorona9
Most online: 1221 users on 25 Feb 2020, 12:03 PM